Helpers: The Magic Answer to Anger

Leo Volont wrote:But it would be nice if we could think of a good Plausible Sounding Magic Answer

Nope! It's best to go with whatever solid knowledge and experience you may have to offer.

By the way, the placebo effect is so powerful that medications only need to be a few percent better than it to be approved for use. Heart drugs, blood pressure drugs, diabetes drugs...

Thank you so much CynthiaL, my poor Post was dying of loneliness and neglect.

Oh, I really did not stop and consider how THEY compare actual drugs to the Placebo Effect... but the Placebo Effect is far more than just a Sugar Pill... for the Placebo Effect to work in all its Glory, it has to come with a Show -- a Big Song and Dance Act. the 'Doctor' , or whoever, has to Really be Believable, and in a very Professional Manner subtly Build up the Patients Hopes. Now, in an Ordinary Drug Trial, well, don't the Subjects KNOW that it is a Drug Trial and that they may be getting "only a Placebo"? If that is the case, it is likely that a Re-verse Placebo Effect could kick in, where People pessimistically believe that they were to one who DIDN'T Get the REAL DRUG, and so they hold onto their Horrible Symptoms for as long as they can.

Anyway, thanks again. that was very kind and thoughtful of you.

cynthialeighton wrote:

Leo Volont wrote:But it would be nice if we could think of a good Plausible Sounding Magic Answer

Nope! It's best to go with whatever solid knowledge and experience you may have to offer.

By the way, the placebo effect is so powerful that medications only need to be a few percent better than it to be approved for use. Heart drugs, blood pressure drugs, diabetes drugs...

Leo Volont wrote:But it would be nice if we could think of a good Plausible Sounding Magic Answer… to keep these Posters from ditching us so soon, wouldn’t it?

I don't know about an "answer," but there is a magic solution, one that works an amazing amount of the time. It's called active listening.

I am not trying to sound sarcastic here: I have found in my experience that listening to someone who is upset, without openly judging or criticizing them, helps him or her to calm down immensely. It diffuses the anger and helps to ease tensions. 90% of the time, the person who is upset just wants to feel heard.

In terms of applying active listening on a forum, if a person has trouble with anger management, the best solution is to simply ask questions without judging. Don't attempt to give advice. Don't suggest books he or she should read. Don't suggest that they do a certain practice or stop doing other practices. And please don't write long posts trying to explain and solve their problem.

I would generally start with feeling questions. "Do you feel this way because...?" "Why do you think you feel this way?" "What is it about this experience or person that you feel gets you angry?"

Then, eventually, you can start giving advice and suggestions.

betawarrior wrote:... there is a magic solution, one that works an amazing amount of the time. It's called active listening.

...the best solution is to simply ask questions without judging.

I would generally start with feeling questions. "Do you feel this way because...?" "Why do you think you feel this way?" "What is it about this experience or person that you feel gets you angry?"

Then, eventually, you can start giving advice and suggestions.

Yep, I agree. It is a great technique to build the relationship first, let them talk, ask questions, etc. etc. And if someone wants to take the time to go back and forth and build that relationship on a forum with an anonymous poster, more power to them. To each their own.

Personally, I take the original post and offer advice immediately. Occasionally I might ask a question to clarify, but the vast majority of the time I'm not trying to build rapport with the OP prior to offering advice. That is just me, my choice on how I choose to interact with those seeking advice.

I have also found that active listening is not necessarily a magic bullet. Think about Julius Fawcett, Sakoz and Candy Heels. Lot's of active listening have taken place by multiple members, yet they remain firmly locked tight in their bubbles, closing off the rest of the world. Sometimes even active listening doesn't work, but it is worth a try. If there is a magic answer, I think active listening is definitely worth considering.

betawarrior wrote:

Leo Volont wrote:But it would be nice if we could think of a good Plausible Sounding Magic Answer… to keep these Posters from ditching us so soon, wouldn’t it?

I don't know about an "answer," but there is a magic solution, one that works an amazing amount of the time. It's called active listening.

I am not trying to sound sarcastic here: I have found in my experience that listening to someone who is upset, without openly judging or criticizing them, helps him or her to calm down immensely. It diffuses the anger and helps to ease tensions. 90% of the time, the person who is upset just wants to feel heard.

In terms of applying active listening on a forum, if a person has trouble with anger management, the best solution is to simply ask questions without judging. Don't attempt to give advice. Don't suggest books he or she should read. Don't suggest that they do a certain practice or stop doing other practices. And please don't write long posts trying to explain and solve their problem.

I would generally start with feeling questions. "Do you feel this way because...?" "Why do you think you feel this way?" "What is it about this experience or person that you feel gets you angry?"

Then, eventually, you can start giving advice and suggestions.

Dear Beta... I can't be quite sure are really not an 'Alpha'...

Wow! What a great reply. I was wondering What you were Doing that seemed so ... well, it LOOKED effective, and it seemed Confident and Persuasive. Now that you mention it, you Weren't blathering on and on with advice, but still you seemed to be Showing the Way to None-Anger. I am certainly glad I created this Post so you could finally tell us ALL.... all of us Helpers... what your game plan was. Its Splendid!

For ME to take your advice... and, oh my, I REALLY am in a Rut about giving advice. Look at all of my First Response Posts and they are all from basically the same template. To Change that would be to overcome a great deal of habitual inertia... but isn't that the core of Anger Management... changing Habitual Inertia? I suppose I might LEARN to begin with "Before we get into all the nitty gritty details of this advice or that, maybe we need to know more about what you think and feel, and what you think YOUR SWORN ENEMIES who are all out to get you think and feel... etc, etc. Hmmm... am I on the right track?

Yes, I think you are right about all of this. My Instant Load of Advice was chasing away the clients too soon, but your Active Listening Method would make them feel comfortable long enough to Build a Routine of Coming to this Page. You know, I tell people I swear by all of the (good) Anger Management Books, as a means of being Constantly Reminded to be on Anger Guard... BUT, if this Page were Active Enough, it could fulfill much the same Purpose.

Oh, generally speaking, about Active Listening... well, you can probably guess that I am a Guy, and that I have something of a Residual Ego, considering all my years in Spirituality, and Guys with Egos tend only to listen to themselves... BUT years ago I did make it a Cause and a Priority to begin to just Listen to People when they spoke... and NOT just THINK about what I was going to say next... Preparing a Good Story to tell, while not listening to a Word being spoken to me (but still nodding and going 'Ah huh' when it Looked Like the speaker hit the transitions between thoughts). You see, after a certain age, I became confident enough in my ability to 'hit the ground running' to realize that I did not have to PLAN what I was going to say. I realized that what I typically ended up saying was very close to what I had Planned to Say, so it seemed obvious that I could just skip the Planning Step, and that whatever Unrehearsed Thing I came up with to Say would be Good Enough... even quite Good at times. And this would permit me to opportunity to really LISTEN. Well, it is Amazing what you can learn from People if you just let them talk... if you make them feel comfortable talking to you. Now, I have this strangely retentive Memory... and I tend to remember for YEARS... Decades... what people have said to me in just casual conversations, and when some little obscure Fact finally becomes IMPORTANT, years later, the Memory Pops up clear as a bell like it happened only moments before. there is so much that I KNOW, but only because I listened to people who TOLD ME.

Oh, and I am lucky I am not Shy. I talk plenty with my friends But I open up conversations everywhere.. sometimes with virtual strangers, but commonly with people whom I see on a regular basis... store clerks and customers I recognize from having shopped elbow to elbow with them over the years. These people have given me a virtual encyclopedia of knowledge that I would be without had I been aloof and shy.

thank you so much Beta! Great Reply.

Richard@DecisionSkills wrote:Yep, I agree. It is a great technique to build the relationship first, let them talk, ask questions, etc. etc. And if someone wants to take the time to go back and forth and build that relationship on a forum with an anonymous poster, more power to them. To each their own.

Personally, I take the original post and offer advice immediately. Occasionally I might ask a question to clarify, but the vast majority of the time I'm not trying to build rapport with the OP prior to offering advice. That is just me, my choice on how I choose to interact with those seeking advice.

I have also found that active listening is not necessarily a magic bullet. Think about Julius Fawcett, Sakoz and Candy Heels. Lot's of active listening have taken place by multiple members, yet they remain firmly locked tight in their bubbles, closing off the rest of the world. Sometimes even active listening doesn't work, but it is worth a try. If there is a magic answer, I think active listening is definitely worth considering.

Hi Richard... always a pleasure...

"OP" ??? I had to look it up. Oh! Original Poster... well that will come in handy... I've been back and forth on what exactly to call those People...

Oh, both YOU and Beta have Good Points to make. You know, I think there Should be some Variety in how the different Helpers present their Help. After all, that is why Ice Cream comes in various Flavors, and we all know how effective "Good Cop, Bad Cop" is. As long as at least One of Us can make a connection, then the Page is doing Great.

Beta really scored big on my concern that OPs seemed to be leaving the Page rather quickly... not staying long enough to feel at home. Yes, her Answer is not exactly MAGIC... BUT it might be exactly what people are REALLY here asking for... they just want to TALK. I've read a million times that when Women talk about their Problems, that GUYS make the mistake of trying to SOLVE Things... give Advice... suggest Things that would Help... BUT THAT is not what the Woman intended. She can take care of her own problems. She is smart enough to figure it out all by herself. She just wants to Talk about it... to have a Sounding Board. I myself notice that with all the Thinking I do, sometimes an Idea Crystalized only when I attempt to Explain it to another person. We apparently Talk more carefully and completely to Others than we do with Ourselves, in our Thinking Processes...

... And we can't discount all of the other Methods... Even with Julius! You know, as bazaar and irrelevant as he seems, well, it is entirely possible that, whatever Planet he came from, well, we might someday get an OP from exactly the same place... somebody who will understand, connect with and appreciate what Julius is saying... unless THAT is what makes them So ANGRY!

Richard@DecisionSkills wrote:

betawarrior wrote:Personally, I take the original post and offer advice immediately. Occasionally I might ask a question to clarify, but the vast majority of the time I'm not trying to build rapport with the OP prior to offering advice. That is just me, my choice on how I choose to interact with those seeking advice.

I have also found that active listening is not necessarily a magic bullet. Think about Julius Fawcett, Sakoz and Candy Heels. Lot's of active listening have taken place by multiple members, yet they remain firmly locked tight in their bubbles, closing off the rest of the world. Sometimes even active listening doesn't work, but it is worth a try. If there is a magic answer, I think active listening is definitely worth considering.

I agree. Active listening isn't really a magic bullet. In fact, there isn't really a magic bullet. But Leo wanted something, so I thought I would give him the advice that would help him the most (if you understand what I mean).

I also think giving advice in the first response is fine, especially if you have a lot of experience (which it certainly seems you do). I would just add the caveat that the advice should demonstrate understanding of the person's situation. Using the words "It sounds like you..." really helps there.

Leo Volont wrote:

Richard@DecisionSkills wrote:Yes, her Answer is not exactly MAGIC... BUT it might be exactly what people are REALLY here asking for... they just want to TALK.

I'm not exactly sure who you're referencing here by "her ANSWER," but I just want to clarify for you: I am a guy, not a girl.

Dear M. Betawarrior,

Oh, I am terribly sorry, Sir. Gender still has me all confused from when I studied French. I suppose there was just something in the construction of "Betawarrior" that suggested a 'La' instead of a 'Le'.

Well, also, YOU COMMUNICATE so well. You connect well with emotions. You are Thoughtful of others. After all of that, if you are NOT a woman, than you are a SAINT.

But, please forgive me for my faux pas. But you did write a GREAT REPLY! And I am so appreciative that you've noticed my work around here enough to know exactly in what direction you would go to improve upon it. Yes, I shall try.

Thanks again, M. Betawarrior.