Bf with horrible anger pls help!

#30

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:53 pm

Cece431 wrote:Thanks, but I came here to learn about anger, and see how people with anger issues react to get a better understanding.


Great. And Bert_ernie provide a possible narrative and you agreed it described your BF's behavior. What Bernie described is the cycle of abuse. It takes two to tango.

If you want to learn about behavior, in this case anger, don't be one sided in your focus. You can't learn about why the leopard attacks without also exploring the gazelle.

Your BF gets angry because of your part in the cycle. What is your role in his behavior?

Image
Richard@DecisionSkills
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 12131
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:25 am
Likes Received: 1271


#31

Postby quietvoice » Mon Jul 20, 2015 2:33 pm

Posting the link to above diagram so that one can read the fine print easier.
Click here.
User avatar
quietvoice
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2970
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:14 pm
Likes Received: 320

#32

Postby Candid » Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:37 pm

Cece431 wrote: what Bert wrote earlier was in fact something that my bf could agree and relate to.


Yes, that's what we're looking for. Anything that makes the bf feel better.
User avatar
Candid
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 9886
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:00 am
Likes Received: 498

#33

Postby Candid » Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:32 pm

Cece431 wrote:The reason why I'm NOT discussing in full detail our relationship, or my side of things and so on, is due to the fact that we are in couples therapy...


We've been getting information drip-by-drip here. For instance, I hadn't seen mention of couples therapy when I wrote my last post. You know your issues, you've been in therapy four years for that, and now -- because you two split up last November -- he's joined you in couples therapy. That therapist (and I hope it isn't the same one you've been seeing all along?) sees and hears you both. Why would you come here asking "Bf with horrible anger pls help!"

You keep saying it's because you want to understand anger. Anger arises when someone's boundaries have been crossed. If it can't be dealt with at the time, ie. when it's a small child reacting internally to parental abuse, it gets stuck and goes on playing out. Either for life, or until the person wakes up and does something about it.

Men are typically reluctant to have therapy. Most of them will agree to it only because something they want is at risk, eg. your bf's relationship with you. Attending therapy will placate you and make you think he's doing something about it. He isn't. You are. He can now expect that you will go on dealing with his anger indefinitely.

I've written to you in general terms about anger, which you've said is all you want here. I had no intention that you would consider yourself the person to fix it.

I do see someone regularly for 4 years. With all due respect, do you sincerely believe that I haven't discussed any of this with my phycologist?


I think it highly likely you spend most of your sessions talking about Him. The psychologist will deal with whatever material you give her.

A pro-active one (such as I am) would listen to some information about him, but would keep drawing you back to your own stuff. A lazy therapist will just listen and make sympathetic noises as you go on about your boyfriend's regular explosions. The idea of the latter is that eventually you run out of puff and realise how foolish you sound for putting up with this. Either will get you where you want to go, provided you stick with it, but there's the express route and there's all-around-the-houses. Most clients, especially those who don't have a fortune to spend, want to deal with their own stuff as fast as they can.

Point is, when you've dealt with your stuff you feel much better about yourself and won't want the bother of a partner who hasn't deal with his. Your choice of someone acting-out shows where you've got stuck, and it appears from what you say that your therapist is happy to let you flounder. She's worked out that you'd rather talk about Him than about you, and that if she insists on bringing therapy back to you, you'll probably leave and take your business somewhere else.

So for the subject of my past trauma and enabling his issues blah blah blah, is not at all why I came here.


No. Your first post said:

do you have any suggestions when he blows up on me? For example, I've noticed if he's actually wrong, he gets more angry at me, if he feels like he embarrassed himself, he gets angry at me. If I catch him in a lie, he twist and gets angry at me. What I don't know how to deal with is when he does blow, he holds on to his anger for so long. He will leave me, say he does not love me at all and a week later come back saying I'm the love of his life


... so you apparently wanted a script that would stop him blowing up, or, failing that, one that would stop him walking away from you, and staying away. You wanted to know whether he actually loved you, because on a good day he did and on a bad day he didn't.

This is a re-enactment of what went on for you as a little girl. One or both parents were angry, blew up at you, withdrew their love from you... and you still think there's something you can say or do to stop angry people 'leaving'. After four years in therapy for attachment trauma (with a round-the-houses psychologist), two things:
1) You haven't done anything about the original trauma
2) You think you're now qualified to fix someone who has the same problem:

I spoke to my bf calmly today about his anger, where you made one helpful comment about where you would start. He opened up to me for the first time. We spoke about his brother and father, how it was like growing up it was interesting to learn things he hasn't shared with me in the past...


Maybe that was the script you needed? If it stops him blowing up and telling you he doesn't love you, so much the better.

Self-esteem doesn't sop up the anger and blame for everything someone else is feeling. The time for that was in childhood, when you had no choice. So I'll ask you now, as Richard did on page one:

What about your issues? Would it not be better to learn about anger by looking at you and why you choose to be in a relationship where the man lies, becomes angry and threatens to leave you?
User avatar
Candid
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 9886
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:00 am
Likes Received: 498

#34

Postby Cece431 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:47 pm

Ok clearly there are tons of my posts you've missed... Let me help you:

-"Hi guys,

So I joined this forum today to learn more about anger."

- "For those who suffer from anger issues, do you have any suggestions when he blows up on me?"

- "Can anger actually detach himself from his own feelings of love?? Or does he really not love me?"

- "Because this type of anger is something I don't understand. Can anger take over you so much so that you can hate the person you love within one fight? Can it really take over that much?"

- "Only thing I would have to say is about the comment made about " trying to be a better anger management therapist are we?" Well that to me is ignorance. Learning and having knowledge on a subject is different than trying to put a bandaid on my relationship."

- "so I came here to learn. Not some silly girl who doesn't know that this anger issue in the relationship is unhealthy, and should get out, but to learn overall about anger, rage, how it can effect the persons choices and life, how far can it go? What's the extreme?"

- "I'm very eager to learn about anger in general. Yes I can go to chapters right now and buy a book about anger management, or bring him to an anger management meeting. I came here, on this forum because I thought A) easier and cheaper B) why not hear the opinions of others who suffer from anger overall. I'm having a hard time grasping the fact that anger, or being anger at someone can stop their love in their tracks. It's not that I want to just understand HIM better, I want to understand it for myself."

-"I think Richard was 100% right, and if I really want to learn more about anger, and how anger people react, and to what extremes I should have looked for different resources than this forum. I assumed, if you want to really understand it, go to the source, a community with people that struggle with it, perhaps they have some insight. That was my fault, I will go through some different sites and still continue to read on this site as well"

- "I never said I was in denial about the relationship. I said I want to learn more about anger, this is where I stand at the moment. I've taken other paths and recourses now, although they are great at giving the other all definition of anger, I wanted to see HIS perspective a bit differently than my own."






Ignorance:
The state or fact of being ignorant; lack of knowledge, learning, information, etc.
Lack of knowledge or information.

- synonyms: incomprehension of, unawareness of, unconsciousness of, unfamiliarity with, inexperience with, lack of knowledge about, lack of information about

Knowledge:
facts, information, and skills acquired by a person through experience or education; the theoretical or practical understanding of a subject.

- synonyms: understanding, comprehension, grasp, command, mastery; expertise, skill, proficiency, expertness, accomplishment, adeptness, capacity, capability.

Learning:
the acquisition of knowledge or skills through experience, study, or by being taught.

Phycology:
the scientific study of the human mind and its functions, especially those affecting behavior in a given context.

Communication:
The sharing or exchanging of intimate thoughts and feelings, especially when the exchange is on a mental or spiritual level.

So Candid... Like I've mentioned, I give out info about the relationship "drip by drip" because I didn't want that to take focus from my intention, but I felt obligated to include more details when responding to people's replys. Again, I can't imagine you as a professional since the assumptions you have made so far are based on such vague information, telling me you highly doubt what I discuss in my sessions?. So AGAIN, I'm going to leave the therapy discussion about my relationship to the REAL professionals. Bert gave me some talk about anger, possibilities, and I was able to take what he said, and work with the objective suggestions and communicate it with my bf. And if you think that you're a professional behind your keyboards, then clearly you would have not made a statement "anything that makes your bf happy" because bringing up a sensitive issue about his anger, his childhood, and pushing directly on a trigger for him is NOT easy or fun for anyone involved. But I was surprised at his honesty and reaction. Because I was able to approach the subject for the first time with a calm, supportive attitude with understanding.

As for your pathetic attempts to judge him, myself or even the future, of course you're correct that most men do not like the idea of therapy, and here's where your judgement comes in, unless they have something to gain from it, like working things out with me, well so far his attitude towards it it positive and is showing signs he really wants to help himself. So I will continue to research a subject, anger and learn more.
Cece431
Junior Member
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:13 pm
Likes Received: 0

#35

Postby quietvoice » Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:17 pm

Cece431 wrote:-"Hi guys,

So I joined this forum today to learn more about anger."
[. . .]

What is the source of emotions?
User avatar
quietvoice
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2970
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:14 pm
Likes Received: 320

#36

Postby tokeless » Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:44 pm

Cece431.. What exactly do you want form the forum? You are sounding increasingly angry yourself because the advice you asked for has questioned your relationship. There's a rule of life I have: Don't sit in a barber's chair if you don't want your hair cut.
Perhaps your b/f should post on here and get some 'answers'? Then when/if he learns anything he can feed it back to you from HIS perspective, which you seem to need to know.
The problem with this though is, will he want to? Does he need to? Does he care enough to?

Best wishes
tokeless
Senior Member
 
Posts: 3023
Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 5:17 pm
Likes Received: 394

#37

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Tue Jul 21, 2015 4:11 pm

tokeless wrote: You are sounding increasingly angry yourself because the advice you asked for has questioned your relationship.


I do not detect escalating anger, but more an attempt to assert control over her situation. By dictating this very narrow aspect of anger she wants to explore, specifically focusing on only her BF and his anger, it allows her to block out every other aspect of the situation.

It is the "I'm the CEO/boss/customer" philosophy where only those specific aspects she wants to hear about are on the table to talk about. Any aspect she does not want to discuss she claims to either already know the answer, has already considered or specialists are already helping her address the issue, etc.

I think it understandable. It is a normal reaction of someone in a bad situation trying to gain some control. While the real problem is huge leak in the bottom of the ship, to gain some sense of control she wants to only discuss the size of the buckets being used to bail out the water. Anyone that mentions the huge leak she tells she already knows about the huge leak, professionals are helping with the huge leak, now only focus on the size of the buckets as that is what she wants to discuss. Fair enough, it is her thread.
Richard@DecisionSkills
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 12131
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:25 am
Likes Received: 1271

#38

Postby Cece431 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:56 pm

I actually find it interesting how many people seem almost agitated. It's a post, no one needs to reply if they don't want to, or don't like what I write. The way people are responding is interesting to me to see the frustrations, "well then what do you want?" .."clearly you're you don't want to admit your own issues" ect... These people are reading, making their suggestions but when rejected on my side, bothers them enough to respond back with a more aggressive attitude, with hostility. This thread in it's own way is showing me more about anger than I initially thought, and how people react when they consider "sound advice" is rejected. I'm not angry at all with their post, unless it's in fact insulting towards me. Other than that ... I keep writing and responding, and watching the different people get more activated with my dismissive attitude towards them. I asked the question to better understand my bfs outbursts, a person close to me, to understand from someone with trouble controlling their temper see what it was like for him, his perspective, rather than read it from a book I wanted to see from other people's past experience with anger, is there any reaching them, can therpay work, but over all what's it like to see "red". The comments about being in an abusive relationship were the main focus and topic, which I do already know. Richard you made an example in the beginning when I asked if someone with some sort of mental issue deserves to be alone. I asked you this not to lets day justify my relationship or staying with him, since I don't even know at this very moment if I will be, but more interested if THEY want to get help can they recover? The person Bert that replied I thought was cool, because he kept it light, throwing ideas around and his thoughts on the matter of anger and maybe what's going on, just for a fun topic to discuss. Was it what I wanted to hear? Yes, because that was why I originally posted. Anyways for anyone feeling like I'm angry, or upset about the feedback left, I'm truly not. Maybe I'm just pushing your own buttons by me not thanking you for advice based purely on the relationship, rather than the subject of anger.
Cece431
Junior Member
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:13 pm
Likes Received: 0

#39

Postby quietvoice » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:16 pm

quietvoice wrote:
Cece431 wrote:-"Hi guys,
So I joined this forum today to learn more about anger."
[. . .]

What is the source of emotions?

Have you given this any thought?
User avatar
quietvoice
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2970
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:14 pm
Likes Received: 320

#40

Postby Candid » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:29 pm

Cece431 wrote: I asked the question to better understand my bfs outbursts, a person close to me, to understand from someone with trouble controlling their temper see what it was like for him...


I think we've all had a glimpse of what it's like for him.
User avatar
Candid
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 9886
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:00 am
Likes Received: 498

#41

Postby Cece431 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:33 pm

But really if people want to actually discuss to abusive aspect, the anger and what I call "power over" in a relationship than I'm happy to approach my opinions on that subject as well. Problem is, to me anyways, if I'm aware of the basic issue, and lets call it circle of abuse, what exactly is the point of me discussing it. Will it help me more if I've already, on my own side discussed it a great lengths with professionals, along with putting an end to what some people mentioned as enabling. The book as I've mentioned a few times called "the verbally abusive relationship" to me, as written very well, it would be my number one suggestion to learn about an abusive relationship, the different realties both partners are living in. Examples exactly what happens when you do enable the inappropriate anger, or words, overall attitude of someone with an abusive personality in a relationship. It describes so perfectly how manipulating the partner can be, and how some women don't even know that they are being mentally abused. It was a very good read. It starts off slowly explaining how women's ego's and self esteem can be diminished over a long period of time, and constantly questioning themselves. If their partner gets angry with them, the women usually spends a lot of her time wondering " what did I do to set him off??!?" And when they try and discuss it, the partner will usually turn around and blame, twist and go to great lengths to make the women feel like it was her fault I. The beginning. "Well if you didn't do this in the first place I wouldn't have been so upset!!!" Eventually that sort of blame will destroy the women's ability to be able to trust her own thoughts, and the abuse continues until the women is brought down little by little, and find it harder to leave the relationship with zero confidence left. While reading this book I got to learn a lot about not only what it's like to be with an abusive man, but I learned how sublet some manipulation can be..book is by Patricia Evans. Another great book is "The road less traveled" by M. Scott Peck. So the talk about enabling, and circle of abusive is not a subject I'm unfamiliar with. The judgement comments "I doubt you speak in therapy about the full extent of your relationship" makes me laugh from a stranger to a stranger. Now, knowing what I do know, I never would tolerate any type of the above behavior patterns mentioned. I'm so unfamiliar with the subject unyet, I broke up with him, kicked him out of our house back in Nov 2014. But again, this was not something I felt needed to be discussed and when people were posting the topic of our unhealthy relationship, I was avoided it only not to have to go further into more details that are in fact already being handled in my everyday life. But recently the curiosity reached me. What is it like to be anger, have outbursts. Remember I did ask, can a person literally stop feelings, love, in their tracks when getting angry? For me when I'm mad and even if I have exploded during a fight, I never lost touch with feelings, of course the love did not leave my heart and mind. So I wanted to hear it from someone who has had anger issues in a relationship, see in this type of community and form if there was a person that could relate to HIM and maybe explain how they feel when they were angry. Like I said I realized THIS was not the right way, and taken different paths to answer these questions. But like I said, I keep posting see other people's reactions and point of views. People have mentioned that I'm now angry lol!
Cece431
Junior Member
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:13 pm
Likes Received: 0

#42

Postby Cece431 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:45 pm

Candid wrote:
Cece431 wrote: I asked the question to better understand my bfs outbursts, a person close to me, to understand from someone with trouble controlling their temper see what it was like for him...


I think we've all had a glimpse of what it's like for him.


I think you personally must have low self esteem, anger issues overall to get hostile with someone over their own opinions that have no damage to you what so ever. You're reaction to me rejecting your usless advice you should probably get help on your own, because if a topic from a stranger can hit you so personally, to bring out hostile comments shows how upsetting it is for you when someone had dismissed your advice. We have choice to control our anger, you have the choice to post your comments and a person with healthy confidence would read, then ignore... But you... You can't fight the urge to let your frustration out, and take a shot, a jab at me. The fact that you've made a basic open subject from a stranger so personal I think is fascinating. Lose all integrity out of, rejection, frustration and lets call it, anger. Lol good luck candid.
Cece431
Junior Member
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:13 pm
Likes Received: 0

#43

Postby Cece431 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:49 pm

quietvoice wrote:
Cece431 wrote:-"Hi guys,

So I joined this forum today to learn more about anger."
[. . .]

What is the source of emotions?


Yes, maybe you can read through my last post...
Cece431
Junior Member
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:13 pm
Likes Received: 0

#44

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:56 pm

Cece431 wrote: Richard you made an example in the beginning when I asked if someone with some sort of mental issue deserves to be alone. I asked you this not to lets day justify my relationship or staying with him, since I don't even know at this very moment if I will be, but more interested if THEY want to get help can they recover?


It is two independent issues. Them "deserving" to be alone is a different issue than if they want help can they recover. This actually presents four possibilities.

-1- Not alone, willing to recover

-2- Alone, willing to recover

-3- Not alone, not willing to recover

-4- Alone, not willing to recover

It appears that you are only interested in learning about anger through the frame of -1-, is it possible to stay with an angry person and have them willing to recover.

I want to clarify that "deserve" to be alone is different than should be alone. And we are only talking about the term 'alone' in the context of not having romantic relationships. A resounding YES, there are people that are not ready for a healthy relationship. People that abuse or accept abuse are examples of people not ready. There are friends, family, the community there to provide support, so they are not entirely alone.

As for is scenario 1 possible? Yes, certainly it is possible.
Richard@DecisionSkills
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 12131
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:25 am
Likes Received: 1271


PreviousNext

  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to Anger Management