What is wrong with Anger?

Because...getting TOO angry can be a problem. There must be a part of you that thinks you have a problem since your here. The reason we have issues with anger is because we feel people need to meet our expectations in life and when they don't, we don't understand that...so we blow up in our own way. Here is the thing....we can't expect people to meet our expectations because most times...they wont. That's ok!! because everyone is different!! blowing up on people for taking too long or whatever is going a little too far. Some people aren't as fast as you...you can't change that...might as well accept it and move on. Plus, getting mad at them for taking too long will only piss them off because they can't help that. So, you know....there is such thing as healthy anger and unhealthy anger. I'm still learning how to keep my anger under control. It's hard. I'm a implosive angry person. It builds and then I blow...I'm working on it though. It's hard to change what your so used to, but it's possible to turn it around.

Alan8w wrote:I've read a few posts here and have looked at some videos on YouTube - yet, I still don't get it - I Am Right, so what is wrong at getting angry with others?
If the jerk doesn't know how to drive, or he crosses the road when he shouldn't or takes too long at check out - what is wrong in telling him off - "wake-up! You jerk!" ??
I am standing on my grounds and I am not getting the "useless others" to control my life!

Why would I need NOT to get angry?

Useless people huh? None of these examples you have given are reasons to get angry. None of your examples are "your grounds", someone else is doing the action that has nothing to do with you.. Telling people off for something that doesn't involve you is allowing the world to controll you. Have any of them ever stopped and said " Hey, your right, thanks for pointing out how stupid I am", or do they respond well in any way to your tactics? Probably not. So what are you accomplishing ? Nothing.
McCain

Hi Terra, and thank you. Yes, of course, if I am here it is because "there is an issue". Question is: is it an issue for me or for others? Why is it an issue? I am quite happy yelling at others or being aggressive. You are absolutely right - OUR expectations. They are also high standard expectations - or this is how I perceive them. So, if I am good or fast, what is wrong with others to keep up with us? Why shouldn't we "train" them to become better people? Better drivers? Ready at the post office or at check outs? People reach the gates at the underground and - guess what? They start looking for the pass. As they walk to the gates or up the escalator - what do they think is going to happen once they reach the gates? Due to some miracle the gates will open "just for them"!?
Isn't anger positive for all?
Positive for us so that we let the "steam out" - and good for others that, maybe for once in their life they use the brain and pay more attention to what they are doing (car, bicycle, pedestrian, underground)!?!?

McCain, people don't say thank you and rarely they are appreciative. If we all take the attitude that it is all right to be dumb - how can we ever improve the world?

Alan8w wrote:McCain, people don't say thank you and rarely they are appreciative. If we all take the attitude that it is all right to be dumb - how can we ever improve the world?

Has the world improved with all your efforts? Is anyone listening? Why does venting on strangers make you feel useful?
McCain

Alan8w wrote:I've read a few posts here and have looked at some videos on YouTube - yet, I still don't get it - I Am Right, so what is wrong at getting angry with others?
If the jerk doesn't know how to drive, or he crosses the road when he shouldn't or takes too long at check out - what is wrong in telling him off - "wake-up! You jerk!" ??
I am standing on my grounds and I am not getting the "useless others" to control my life!

Why would I need NOT to get angry?

Well, yes, I guess you are right, if you are being completely honest with us.

After all, Anger Management is for people who have Anger Problems, that is, for people who recognize Anger as being a problem. And clearly you do not see Anger as a problem. Indeed you seem to find Anger to be an essential element to your chosen Life Style – how you evaluate situations and people in your life and how you behave toward them.

Now, when people start having problems with their Anger is when they begin experiencing negative results from it – ie. getting fired from work; having a spouse file for divorce against you; spending a weekend in jail for getting in a fight with a total stranger over a rush hour dispute over a traffic lane; etc, you know, all that kind of stuff that a person can feel he is absolutely in the right about, but then express it so strongly to others that they too get infuriated and react back in retaliation, or what they consider to be their defense. A person may be right, but others may object to the Big Screaming Deal that the person makes out of every little minor thing, as it may seem to them.
Also, to differentiate. Anger is our Behavior. Anger is not a feeling. But Hate is a feeling. When you Hate somebody or something, then you get angry about it. Well, for many of us, we find Hate to be an uncomfortable emotion. That is why we hear so much of ‘Angry’ Feelings, because people don’t even want to think that they are being motivated by Hate. But in trying to minimize their ‘angry’ feelings, they are responding to the very unpleasantness we feel in our hearts and souls when we allow ourselves to be filled with hate.

All the hate doesn’t bother you a bit? When you are Angry, doesn’t your mind spin with all the things you should say, all the things you should do to properly express your anger – to teach people lessons – to right all of the world’s wrongs, even when everybody else thinks everything is just fine… and then you hate them for that.

Now, yes, if none of it honestly bothers you at all, then you are completely right, and you do not have an issue with your Anger, and anger management is not a thing you need in your life. But keep it in mind. These things tend to escalate, and while everything may now be within ‘acceptable limits’ that may change in the future if your judgmental thinking and angry behaviors significantly augment and expand.

Thank you Leo. May I say that you started well (no arrogance at all in this, please) but you "moved" to Hate. Can't say I hate anyone, actually. Might have "dislikes" (football, politics, media, religion, 'races') but, most definitely not, any hate for anyone/anything.
Negative results!? The only one I can think of is my health. High cortisol probably increases my glucose and hypertension might be part of my anger too. Work? Nope, it never happened. Jail? Only once but I was "defending" my rights. Denial? I would say not, I've been like this since I remember and I am now in my 60s.
Has the world improved?(McCain). No, probably not, in fact just now I have deleted 20 friends (spectators) from Facebook. People are set in their ways and no matter what I say or post, it will go in one ear and out of the other.
This exchange of words has helped me to realize that, in fact, what is the point in getting angry? However, it is frustrating, it will not be easy to move away from my "life style" and I wonder what next stage will be like: "bottling inside all the repressed emotions"? Thank you all for your kind input.
[Somewhat, I feel a sense of been defeated. If we cannot improve the world are we just "dust" passing by?]

Alan8w wrote:Thank you Leo. May I say that you started well (no arrogance at all in this, please) but you "moved" to Hate. Can't say I hate anyone, actually. Might have "dislikes" (football, politics, media, religion, 'races') but, most definitely not, any hate for anyone/anything.

Dear Alan,

Oh, I understand why you don't like the word 'hate'. Nobody does. The only thing people will admit to hating is the word 'hate'. But I have been driven by Logic to use that word, 'hate', and you may please feel free to suggest any more preferable word that means about the same thing. But here at this Site people use the word 'Anger' to mean two different things -- they want it to mean both the Emotion that provokes Angry Behavior, and the Angry Behavior itself. But what are we? Savages? We are all scientifically trained well enough to understand that we must be specific about things, and that precision requires that each separate Thing have a separate word to represent it. It is like Mathematics in which it is forbidden that any one variable represent more than one class or quantity.

so when speaking of Anger provoking Emotions, instead of saying 'angry emotions' or 'anger' as though it were an emotion in and of itself, I use 'hateful emotions’ and 'hate'. It seems to fit. People just hate the word ‘hate’. People don't mind being 'angry' but they shun being thought of as 'hateful'.

But what is the Internal Dialogue like when you are working up a good Anger Episode. Well, you aren't saying to yourself "This makes me angry" or "that makes me angry". No, I bet it is more than likely "I hate this" and "I hate that". Now that is the truth of it, isn't it?

And, yes, I agree with you that you do not have an 'anger problem'. People, even your friends, might find you 'cranky' or ‘codgedy’ or 'opinionated', but apparently you have not crossed the line into troubled territory, and at your age, I don't see you really getting worse... especially since apparently you are aware that Other People have problems and you don't want to be one of them.

Thanks for the reply.

" However, it is frustrating, it will not be easy to move away from my "life style" and I wonder what next stage will be like: "bottling inside all the repressed emotions"?


Alan,
This statement speaks volumes. Your not angry for what is happening in the present, your angry about something from the past. What about this "lifestyle " of angry guy ? Could this be the reason you vent, it helps you dysfunctionally relieve these repressed emotions?
What happened?
McCain

Thank you Guys.
Anger (Hate) = Frustration = Emotions (?). Sorry, I am trying to work out your comments. My first recollection of anger was probably around when I was 10 years old. Parents pissed me off and I lifted the dining room door off its hinges. Too heavy to put it back, I required their help to do so - but in anger it was no problem. Emotions!? = Communication (lack of). Pushed a couple of guys in my young teens because I was protecting "girls of my dreams" (some sort of knight in shining armour).
I will work on your comments [vent, dysfunctionally relieve, repressed emotions, What happened (indeed)?]

Hi Alan,

Good to see you back.

Yeah, a little kid flipping a heavy oak door off its hinges. That is Adrenaline doing its job. Anger, as a physiological response, is mostly driven by the release of Adrenaline when the body's endocrine system releases a flood of it when the 'organism' somehow feels endangered or threatened. It’s the Flight or Fight reaction – all Mammals have it. Well, because our Thinking, Perceptions, and Judgement may be sometimes exaggerated or distorted, our 'organism', relying only on the Thoughts and Emotional Evaluations being presented to the Deeper Inner Core Mind by the Surface Cerebral Mind, well, mistakes happen, and Adrenaline is released, most of the time, when there is no real danger or threat. Instead of reacting to Real dangers, like all the other animals do, Human Beings often Imagine dangers that are not really there. But the Endocrine System doesn’t know that.

Adrenaline is often a good thing. Have you heard or read about Mothers who flip over 2 ton cars to rescue their babies. Well, that is Adrenaline doing what it is supposed to be doing. Oh, here’s a wild story for you: I was once a motorcycle racer, and they got a video of me being in an accident on the track -- my bike tee-boned a downed bike that fell down right in front of me. in just milliseconds I flexed my legs, and pushed off with my arms and launched myself up into the air, apparently so that I could fly unscathed above all the wreckage and turmoil below. At the zenith of my jump, i threw my hands up and tossed my legs down, synchronized in such a way that the force of my legs going down caused an opposite and equal reaction which kept me up in the air, and then the momentum of my arms going up, kept me going up. i had some serious 'hang time' going on. When I inevitably came down, i went into a forward tuck so that my upper back, with my head and neck tucked under so I wouldn’t break my neck, was the first thing to hit the ground, and then I was like a ball, and hit at such a slight angle to the ground that there was not enough force to break any bones. and then I rolled, tucked up like a ball, until my forward speed slowed down enough, to about running speed, and then I uncurled and sprang up into the air – that is the first thing I remember after seeing that I was going to inevitably hit that downed bike – and I hit the ground running and I ran the rest of the momentum off as I headed off the track toward the protective barriers (an accident isn’t over until you are off the track and behind something big and solid). And the remarkable thing is that I have no memory of doing any of that, not until I sprang into that run. It was a classic and text book Adrenaline Reaction. The Adrenaline released some inner capacity of the Mind and Muscular System to Intelligently and Forcefully do whatever it takes to survive. Oh, yes, my body did have some training. I did some high diving and gymnastics in my youth, and so my body had some ideas and practices set aside on how to make a good survival game plan. Or maybe anyone would have done the same thing…

But, Adrenaline, the same thing that saved me, also leads to violent rage "black outs" in people who are only imagining they are under life threatening conditions.

Everything is either a blessing or a curse. Whether we use it right or use it wrong.

Stressed! Yes. I would say I have been stressed all of my life. Cortisol is high but not very high. With all of this stress I would have expected higher blood readings. McCain is right there's always some other feeling that gave rise to my anger - what? where? why?
From the list - repressed emotions come to the top. What are they or how were they formed? No idea.
I've been with my partner for 28 years - there is no love anymore - she is the shoulder (sometimes) where I can confess my troubles and worries, and the mother of our children. No physical attraction what so ever. Yet I can get very emotional when I see lovely, slim young women. Recollections of my younger years? Is this some sort of old age crises - for which I feel not old but I still feel the same young chap that used to have fun (but worries)!? Why can't I think of one past relationship as with: "What IF"? Lovely memories but; full stop. On the other hand (still talking about emotions) I easily fall in love with lovely ladies and dream of what would it be like.....
Yet, similar to "The fox and the grapes" when no connection is established (which happens all the time), I come up with "excuses" - she wasn't right after all. But looking at these lovely women there is a sense of sadness and, of course, desire with, again, "what if"!
Hence the anger (which is no hate) is the mouth of the vulcano that, having bottled so much emotion and frustration, it has decided to explode towards others.
[PS - Young and sensible guy is looking for young, slim and attractive woman to..take care of him]

Alan8w wrote: ... dream of what would it be like.....
Yet, similar to "The fox and the grapes" when no connection is established (which happens all the time), I come up with "excuses" - she wasn't right after all. But looking at these lovely women there is a sense of sadness and, of course, desire with, again, "what if"!
Hence the anger (which is no hate) is the mouth of the vulcano that, having bottled so much emotion and frustration, it has decided to explode towards others.
[PS - Young and sensible guy is looking for young, slim and attractive woman to..take care of him]

Well, people simply are not use to using the word "hate". But hate is the primary negative emotion. And we should not be calling 'anger' an emotion; it is a behavioral response to an emotion, and so we shouldn't fall back on calling the Emotion that causes anger, well, 'anger'. That would be logical tautology and doesn't explain anything. It’s like saying red is red or blue is blue, a dog is a dog or a cat is a cat. Tautologies don’t explain anything. You can’t use a word to define itself.

So let us assume that we just are not used to thinking in terms of hate. So let’s start by looking at your inner situation. I would say that a lot of your negative feelings come from frustration with your life. That would fit the notion which you mentioned in your post that you suspected you might be having a Mid Life Crisis – well, you might be spot on …. Mid Life Crisis is almost always about the "What If's" and the regrets and the lost hopes of youth and all of the dreams that never came true and pondering a slow and painful demise. Depressing, huh? And when it is a bit pronounced and the negative feeling run a bit high, well, doesn't it fit to say that one hates one's Life? It’s not just other people and things that we can hate. We can hate the general situation we are in.

So you show signs of at least hating certain aspects of your life, and that has you down, and you may be acting a bit grumpy, like an old curmudgeon (that was a word I was groping for a few posts back), but you have not displayed any troubling degree of Anger. All of your behaviors are still in the range of social acceptability. But, yes, you are discontented with your attitude toward life. Sounds like you need to tweak the way you think about things.

Anyway, let me leave you, for the moment, with a suggestion regarding a book I think you should read. It’s about Cognitive Behavior Therapy. The premise behind cognitive behavior therapy is that when people are angry or depressed because of their negative thinking, well, it makes the most sense to address the problem by addressing the Thinking behind the problem. No, there is no churning up the past and talking about Mother and Childhood – all that is ancient history. The Idea is to simply learn how to turn off the negative thinking, or learn to think of something else instead. It also involves reevaluating your thinking in regards to whether you have been nurturing misconceptions or exaggerating generalizations. Anyway, the name of the book I have in mind is “Cognitive and Dialectical Therapy Unleashed”, by James Ashley. It’s a good book and very affordable. Read it. I think it might help you to reorder the way you see your life going. Let me know how it works out for you.

Oh, an idea just came to me. Even if you got your head on all the way straight, well, what good is life if you aren’t having any fun? And it sounds to me like you could use some positive fun. Do you have any pleasurable hobbies? It may not be too late to take up running, or music – something that you can do that will fill a few hours a day with just some plain ol’fun. I know for years that my Music Practices have kept me from depression. Also, my pet cats. If you are retired and have plenty of time, you could get a dog, and the right dog can be even more fun to have than a cat (don’t tell my cats I said that). Sometimes a person only needs Loving Companionship. People think they need that kind of loving companionship from other people, but actually not. Studies show that a good pet dog or cat offers the same level of stress relief as a close and positive relationship with another person (and you just can’t go to a pet store and get another human being, and all the people you see running about, well, not many are inclined to volunteer to dedicate their entire lives to being your loving pet). I had pets when I was a child but throughout my adulthood I sort of left that behind. Until one day a stray cat climbed through my window. I didn’t chase it away, and I would put food out for it. It would sit on the arm of the sofa and watch TV with me. That’s all. No cuddling affection. Just being there with me. And looking back at that time, well, it was a turning point in my life. Everything started getting better and only afterwards I figured out that it all happened because I left a window open.

anger does not improve our relationships or our health

The ego tells us anger is right, the heart tells us to be more kind

When we have had enough of personal suffering we choose kindness, forgiving, acceptance and love. This always happens at the perfect time