Roommate with Asperger's Syndrome

**Posts:** 3 · by **alreadytaken** » Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:27 am

Hello,
I was hoping to get some advice on how to handle a situation with a person diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome.

We were friends from childhood online, and as we got older (19-20) he decided he'd like to move out of his parent's house to where I live, across the country, because he knew about 3 people in my area. When he moved out here I discovered he had no plan about where to live, so I had to help him find a place to move into off Craigslist. He worked at a department store and could transfer, though, so he had a job.

When he moved out here I discovered he was (offline) very socially awkward and coarse. He shouted everything, and had a habit of pointing at people vigorously while talking to them and having absolutely no manners or common sense. For example, he was asked to go buy a bottle of vodka by one of our friends because she forgot her ID. She gave him a 20 dollar bill and told him to get whatever was cheap and bring her the change. He was in the store for 20 minutes, and came out with a 30 dollar bottle of vodka. He spent all her money and spent 10 more dollars to get it. He said he didn't know what to buy and so he called someone he knew and asked what a good brand was, and bought that, even thought it cost 30 bucks. Our friend got very upset that he spent all her money when she explicitly told him not to do that.

He does stuff like this all the time. Eventually, all his friends from online that he knew out here stopped talking to him except for me. His manners have actually gotten much better and he stopped the pointing habit after we told him how rude it was numerous times.

He moved into another place after his roommate died (long story...), with the help of the friend mentioned earlier. He lived there for a while, and then lost his job at the store for writing a profanity "f**king" on a note to a coworker (it was used as an adjective; not directed at anyone). This is when I found out officially that he was diagnosed with Asperger's. He went to court and was given unemployment because the store failed to take his disability into account. I also found out his job at the store before he moved out here was given to him through a persons with disabilities program.

During the time he was trying to get unemployment, he couldn't afford his apartment anymore. My boyfriend was looking for someone to rent a room to, and so I suggested this friend move in with my boyfriend. So he did. I really wish I hadn't suggested this, looking back on it.

He stayed on unemployment for over a year and didn't get another job. He had help from an unemployment program, and he was so unable to do anything they asked that they referred him to a psychiatrist. He finally got a job at a fast food place after his unemployment was cut, and has been working part-time minimum wage ever since.

This is very frustrating to my boyfriend, who expected the very low rent was going to be a temporary thing until he got back on his feet (he doesn't pay any utilities or do any sort of work around the house/yard). Instead, that is all this guy can afford and he won't get a second job, and probably couldn't manage scheduling two jobs, anyway. It's basically like I just forced my boyfriend into having a teenage son, and it's terrible because we don't know quite what to do about him. It's hard to talk to him rationally, because he has a very distorted sense of reality (he thinks he's doing just fine, and that working 4 hours in a day is super hard and working at 11am one day and 4pm the next is a drastic swing schedule...). He has a hard time managing his time, usually staying up all night playing games on the internet. When he's not at work all he does is stay in his room and play on the computer, although recently he's started modifying toys (he has a huge collection of figurines). He'll say things like, "Well, I have to go to work at 11am tomorrow and it's 10pm now. I guess I won't be sleeping tonight." He's now on medication, but I don't know what situation he's in with the mental health services.

We feel that he really needs to either go back home or go to college so he can earn a better living (he's very knowledgeable about certain subjects) but he flat out refuses to go back home and is apathetic about school (we've tried to get him to fill out a FAFSA for the last two years short of actually sitting down with him and doing it together). He's 25 now.

My boyfriend is very nice and is trying his hardest to give this guy all the options he can while trying to maintain boundaries. It's hard to know where to draw the lines, because he needs so much help with everything. My boyfriend taught him how to do dishes (he literally didn't know... I also had to teach him how to make his bed because he kept putting the sheets on sideways so they didn't actually cover the bed), how to take care of his car when it broke down, how to look for a job, etc.

We're not sure how to get him out on his own, or into the care of someone that can make sure he does what he needs to do to get by safely (there have been problems with people taking advantage of him before). Is there anyone with any advice? It would be greatly appreciated because we really are at a loss of what to do short of just straight kicking him out of the house. We don't want to be his caregivers forever, but that is where this feels like it is going!

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

**Posts:** 248 · by **kapitokrug** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:24 pm

One word: Heritage.

He needs to belong to a community that actually celebrates who people are in order to be motivated to work. That way, he has an identity with what's going on around him.

A lot of people with Asperger's are really just sensitive victims of parental negligence. Their own parents get fed up with them, so they don't bother teaching them anything that's supposed to just be common sense.

In turn, they grow up totally misunderstanding of social customs.

For example, it might have taken so long for him to fill out the FAFSA form not because of laziness, but because of anxiety and pointlessness. Likewise, he might not grasp nuances because he just doesn't see a value. There can also be a lack of mindfulness because his attention span is overloaded from being frustrated.

Also, he probably plays games online because all he knows is problem solving. He's trying to escape social alienation by exploring a new world and (ironically) being virtually productive. Because of his sensitivity, he's not in touch with emotional satisfaction, especially from being alienated so long such that people treated him as selfish for wanting to be happy. If you ask him about having fun, he probably gets extremely awkward.

One thing I see among sufferers of Asperger's is... they believe everyone around is "above" them. They're extremely submissive people who constantly believe they're under the gun over having to behave, yet ironically, they come off as very domineering. It's not even intentional like a defense mechanism. It's because they're passionately absorbed in their own attention span, so they don't see how others see them. They lack a sense of the "other" because they're constantly worried about themselves and making sure others don't get on their case.

This might seem backwards, but what you should do is actually talk with him about being an equal and having confidence in himself. On the other hand, he needs to not be arrogantly obsessed with power because that reveals his intentions too quickly and makes him appear dictatorial rather than cooperative. He needs to think artistically about style so he communicates in a charming, attractive, sociable way.

For example, he's probably awkward around women because he doesn't understand the value of time when it comes to intimacy. He's sensitive, so he's constantly trying to relieve himself in the moment instead of gradually engaging details. That way, pleasure builds and lasts, and it shows an understanding of how to be intense without hurting someone. He's also probably so embarrassed from being alienated that he doesn't know how to flirt by being a creative thinker. When people are alienated, their egos become crushed, so they lose their sense of optimism. Instead, they just want to do the bare minimum to get on by because life seems so hopeless.

He needs heritage in his life so he can relate with others around him and care about being involved in society. That's where style is learned from.

**Posts:** 155 · by **Thajocoth** » Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:50 pm

I have Asperger's. Basically, social things that other people pick up easily do not come naturally to us. That doesn't mean we can't learn them though. In my case, my mother would go to the extra effort of teaching me things that other people would pick up on without help. (Eye contact is one that I taught myself.) Obviously this isn't going to cover every situation, but my girl has been filling in some of the holes.

So he has some social difficulties... But is he willing to learn if taught? If he's not willing, then don't bother trying. You cannot teach him anything he has no interest in. That's just part of how it works. But if he wants to learn, then he needs a teacher.

As for being loud... It's pretty common for speech to get slurred. Being asked "what" enough times winds up increasing volume instead of clarity, because the person doesn't understand why they're not being heard. (I HATE being asked to repeat myself... But I understand it. I don't yell & I try to be as clear as I can, because I've done enough study on this to understand. I take a breath, wait a second, then repeat.)

Also keep in mind that his senses may work differently. Too strongly or too numb... Mine are all stronger than normal. This effects my diet a lot. It effects all of my body's inputs as well as my thought process. Something normal for you (like a pat on the back) might be incredibly intense for him, or barely register...

To hear about his job situation... What a waste. In my field, my difference is a gift that gives me an edge. It's not a disability for me. I understand his situation is different but if he managed to get a job in a field that was his "focus", like, whatever his main hobby is that he probably obsesses over, I feel confident that he'd do fantastically at it. I love video games. They were my only hobby for the first 25 years of my life. I'm typing this while waiting for my code to compile at work. Asperger's doesn't have to be a disability.

...Or maybe I'm just really lucky. I don't know.

I hope this helps.

**Posts:** 248 · by **kapitokrug** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:46 pm

Thajocoth wrote:So he has some social difficulties... But is he willing to learn if taught? If he's not willing, then don't bother trying. You cannot teach him anything he has no interest in. That's just part of how it works. But if he wants to learn, then he needs a teacher.

As for being loud... It's pretty common for speech to get slurred. Being asked "what" enough times winds up increasing volume instead of clarity, because the person doesn't understand why they're not being heard. (I HATE being asked to repeat myself... But I understand it. I don't yell & I try to be as clear as I can, because I've done enough study on this to understand. I take a breath, wait a second, then repeat.)

This is what I meant before about social customs. People with Asperger's don't understand how sometimes, they get ignored on purpose. It's not that they're not clear. It's that people don't care or enjoy seeing others' heads spin. Other times, it's because people expect to simply dish off simple instructions with the rest remaining implicit. When people with Asperger's lack the implicit portion, they're deemed too difficult to be bothered.

Also keep in mind that his senses may work differently. Too strongly or too numb... Mine are all stronger than normal. This effects my diet a lot. It effects all of my body's inputs as well as my thought process. Something normal for you (like a pat on the back) might be incredibly intense for him, or barely register...

Again, the sensitivity.

To hear about his job situation... What a waste. In my field, my difference is a gift that gives me an edge. It's not a disability for me. I understand his situation is different but if he managed to get a job in a field that was his "focus", like, whatever his main hobby is that he probably obsesses over, I feel confident that he'd do fantastically at it. I love video games. They were my only hobby for the first 25 years of my life. I'm typing this while waiting for my code to compile at work. Asperger's doesn't have to be a disability.

Right. Asperger's people aren't necessarily lazy.

**Posts:** 14 · by **alreadytaken2** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:03 am

In case anyone wonders: Something went weird with my account here so I signed up for a new one.

Some of what you're saying kapitokrug rings true.

kapitokrug wrote:One word: Heritage.

He needs to belong to a community that actually celebrates who people are in order to be motivated to work. That way, he has an identity with what's going on around him.

I think that is why he retreats to the internet so much. The problem is that it becomes escapism, because those people (I was one of them at some point) don't actually know what is going on with him.

kapitokrug wrote:A lot of people with Asperger's are really just sensitive victims of parental negligence. Their own parents get fed up with them, so they don't bother teaching them anything that's supposed to just be common sense.

kapitokrug wrote:One thing I see among sufferers of Asperger's is... they believe everyone around is "above" them. They're extremely submissive people who constantly believe they're under the gun over having to behave, yet ironically, they come off as very domineering. It's not even intentional like a defense mechanism. It's because they're passionately absorbed in their own attention span, so they don't see how others see them. They lack a sense of the "other" because they're constantly worried about themselves and making sure others don't get on their case.

These are things I've wondered about. It's hard to tell. He talks disrespectfully about his family. He says things like they don't know how to handle money, calls them hicks, etc, says he brother is lazy and irresponsible (even though his brother is married, has a child and is doing pretty well for himself), and his sister is a whiny spoiled brat who gets whatever she wants (even though his parents give him money whenever he asks for it).

It's irritating to hear because it's so hypocritical. He also did a similar thing with his previous roommate, where he'd declare his roommate was a slob and unreasonable for criticizing his showering habits. What he didn't say is that these habits are excessive. If we don't say anything, he'll shower up to three times a day (sometimes for as long as a half hour, which is a LOT of water).

I'd be more okay with his obsession with cleanliness if he didn't present his rationale as "I get dirty so quickly compared to other people!" as if these habits were reasonable. For instance, we were watching a TV show together when suddenly he dashed to the bathroom and I heard the shower turn on, leaving me dumbfounded, and then he came out 15 min later. I asked what he was doing he said "My hair was greasy." I thought he cut down on the showering when we asked him to save water, considering he doesn't pay anything towards utilities, but I discovered he's just been showering in the middle of the night instead to get 2 showers a day in.

This dirt aversion is also why it's impossible to get him to do any hard work because he doesn't like sweating. He'll offer to help us weed, but then quit after 15 minutes (usually by walking away and not saying anything). He also gets distracted easily, like you mentioned, and will tell us he's going to take care of a chore we're currently doing and then walk away literally right after we stop doing the chore (later he says "I forgot", so now when he makes these offers we just decline).

We also have to remind him constantly not to do certain things, like leaving half-drunk glasses of milk all over the house and hoarding dishes in his room (I think the record now is 8 glasses, 5 bowls and 2 plates + utensils at once; this is after being asked not to do that at least 10 times). What he tries to do now is wait until my boyfriend is at work and then sneak all the dishes he's got in his room back into the kitchen and wash them, but sometimes he'll still get caught when my boyfriend is looking for a dish and discovers they're all missing. It's just... he's such a handful, and it feels like having a child in the house.

kapitokrug wrote:
For example, it might have taken so long for him to fill out the FAFSA form not because of laziness, but because of anxiety and pointlessness. Likewise, he might not grasp nuances because he just doesn't see a value. There can also be a lack of mindfulness because his attention span is overloaded from being frustrated.

I know that is partly the case, but I don't want to be in this mentor/parent role that it would take to get those things done. He doesn't ask for help filling it out, he just makes excuses for it. It's hard to explain why it's different with him to offer assistance...

kapitokrug wrote:This might seem backwards, but what you should do is actually talk with him about being an equal and having confidence in himself.

I think it's this. We're trying to regard him as an adult and able to take care of his affairs without someone walking him through ever step. So we remind him about filling it out, try to get him excited about taking classes in his interests, tell him how to contact a college adviser, etc. But nothing happens.

Like I said, it's hard to know how to approach things.

Thajocoth wrote:
So he has some social difficulties... But is he willing to learn if taught? If he's not willing, then don't bother trying. You cannot teach him anything he has no interest in. That's just part of how it works. But if he wants to learn, then he needs a teacher.

How can I find him one? It can't be my boyfriend and I, it feels wrong to be responsible for his instruction. His family is across the country and I haven't really spoken to them ever.

Thajocoth wrote:Also keep in mind that his senses may work differently. Too strongly or too numb... Mine are all stronger than normal. This effects my diet a lot. It effects all of my body's inputs as well as my thought process. Something normal for you (like a pat on the back) might be incredibly intense for him, or barely register...

I think someone told him he was supposed to be like that. He declared to us one evening after dinner that his "taste buds were stronger than normal peoples." Which was hilarious considering he puts chipotle sauce on everything and eats Airbuds for breakfast.

Thajocoth wrote:To hear about his job situation... What a waste. In my field, my difference is a gift that gives me an edge. It's not a disability for me. I understand his situation is different but if he managed to get a job in a field that was his "focus", like, whatever his main hobby is that he probably obsesses over, I feel confident that he'd do fantastically at it. I love video games. They were my only hobby for the first 25 years of my life. I'm typing this while waiting for my code to compile at work. Asperger's doesn't have to be a disability.

It's hard to tell, again. He amasses knowledge about particular things, but so far it doesn't appear he could be productive with it because of the skills he'd need to have to use that knowledge are not being developed, and I'm not sure what the potential is. We really want him to try, though, and college does seem like the best way. It's just hard to figure out how to get him started, how to get him the support he needs, and how to "teach" him without becoming essentially responsible for him.

Thajocoth wrote:
I hope this helps.

Thanks for the input!

I hope I'm not sounding too much like a jackass about this...

**Posts:** 155 · by **Thajocoth** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:37 am

alreadytaken2 wrote:I think someone told him he was supposed to be like that. He declared to us one evening after dinner that his "taste buds were stronger than normal peoples." Which was hilarious considering he puts chipotle sauce on everything and eats Airbuds for breakfast.

As I said... For some it manifests as the reverse. A sensory numbness. I have trouble being in the same ROOM as spicy food. This makes me think he's one who's gone in the opposite direction.

The showers sound like he's a pretty big germaphobe on top of it all. I suppose the OCD side of Autism would make him predisposed to germaphobia, but I don't see it as a direct link, personally. Unless... Hmm... It's possible that his "focus" is actually his germaphobia. He'd have to work somewhere that they research new products designed for cleaning oneself if this is it.

Regardless, from what you've said, I don't believe you can help him. He doesn't sound like he wants help. He values "being different" highly, for differences both good & bad. This gives him an ego boost, inflating him above whatever's "normal". He would need an epiphany before he could step "down" to your level & try to be part of society.

This fact has nothing to do with having Asperger's. He just uses being Aspie as an excuse for anything. He holds it up like a shield. I hate when people do that. It makes the rest look bad.

**Posts:** 14 · by **alreadytaken2** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:17 am

Thajocoth wrote:As I said... For some it manifests as the reverse. A sensory numbness. I have trouble being in the same ROOM as spicy food. This makes me think he's one who's gone in the opposite direction.

I'm curious about that because I know sensory input differences are present for those with autism, but that's pretty distinct. Something like taste preferences and sensitivity is so highly individual and variable between people.

Thajocoth wrote:The showers sound like he's a pretty big germaphobe on top of it all. I suppose the OCD side of Autism would make him predisposed to germaphobia, but I don't see it as a direct link, personally. Unless... Hmm... It's possible that his "focus" is actually his germaphobia. He'd have to work somewhere that they research new products designed for cleaning oneself if this is it.

Haha, no, he likes reptiles/animals and obsesses over certain entertainment franchises. The germophobia thing is very obvious. I had to convince him not to throw out his shoes when he stepped in dog poo once. He had a fit. I couldn't help but be amused...

Thajocoth wrote:Regardless, from what you've said, I don't believe you can help him. He doesn't sound like he wants help. He values "being different" highly, for differences both good & bad. This gives him an ego boost, inflating him above whatever's "normal". He would need an epiphany before he could step "down" to your level & try to be part of society.

This fact has nothing to do with having Asperger's. He just uses being Aspie as an excuse for anything. He holds it up like a shield. I hate when people do that. It makes the rest look bad.

I wouldn't label most of this behavior as being due to Asperger's. What I don't like is that since he's been seeing a psychiatrist, it appears that she inadvertently affirms that what he does is not his responsibility because he's got this disorder. I've heard him say textbook things about himself, like "I have difficulty showing emotion and reading expression" to explain why he didn't appear interested in something, even though he actually just wasn't interested.

Hm... maybe raising the rent or something to force him to act is the right thing to do, or say that he needs to find his own place, as long as we give him enough time to get into school first (regardless if he follows through).

**Posts:** 248 · by **kapitokrug** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:51 pm

alreadytaken2 wrote:I think that is why he retreats to the internet so much. The problem is that it becomes escapism, because those people (I was one of them at some point) don't actually know what is going on with him.

These are things I've wondered about. It's hard to tell. He talks disrespectfully about his family. He says things like they don't know how to handle money, calls them hicks, etc, says he brother is lazy and irresponsible (even though his brother is married, has a child and is doing pretty well for himself), and his sister is a whiny spoiled brat who gets whatever she wants (even though his parents give him money whenever he asks for it).

It's irritating to hear because it's so hypocritical. He also did a similar thing with his previous roommate, where he'd declare his roommate was a slob and unreasonable for criticizing his showering habits. What he didn't say is that these habits are excessive. If we don't say anything, he'll shower up to three times a day (sometimes for as long as a half hour, which is a LOT of water).

I'd be more okay with his obsession with cleanliness if he didn't present his rationale as "I get dirty so quickly compared to other people!" as if these habits were reasonable. For instance, we were watching a TV show together when suddenly he dashed to the bathroom and I heard the shower turn on, leaving me dumbfounded, and then he came out 15 min later. I asked what he was doing he said "My hair was greasy." I thought he cut down on the showering when we asked him to save water, considering he doesn't pay anything towards utilities, but I discovered he's just been showering in the middle of the night instead to get 2 showers a day in.

This dirt aversion is also why it's impossible to get him to do any hard work because he doesn't like sweating. He'll offer to help us weed, but then quit after 15 minutes (usually by walking away and not saying anything). He also gets distracted easily, like you mentioned, and will tell us he's going to take care of a chore we're currently doing and then walk away literally right after we stop doing the chore (later he says "I forgot", so now when he makes these offers we just decline).

We also have to remind him constantly not to do certain things, like leaving half-drunk glasses of milk all over the house and hoarding dishes in his room (I think the record now is 8 glasses, 5 bowls and 2 plates + utensils at once; this is after being asked not to do that at least 10 times). What he tries to do now is wait until my boyfriend is at work and then sneak all the dishes he's got in his room back into the kitchen and wash them, but sometimes he'll still get caught when my boyfriend is looking for a dish and discovers they're all missing. It's just... he's such a handful, and it feels like having a child in the house.

I know that is partly the case, but I don't want to be in this mentor/parent role that it would take to get those things done. He doesn't ask for help filling it out, he just makes excuses for it. It's hard to explain why it's different with him to offer assistance...

I think it's this. We're trying to regard him as an adult and able to take care of his affairs without someone walking him through ever step. So we remind him about filling it out, try to get him excited about taking classes in his interests, tell him how to contact a college adviser, etc. But nothing happens.

Like I said, it's hard to know how to approach things.

This is what I think:

One, he's showering because he wants to seem responsible and have something to do. Some people actually have the exact opposite problem of never showering.

Two, he walks away from chores because he doesn't see a point. Again, he needs heritage. The chores have to mean something important. The same thing goes for FAFSA. He doesn't see a point. Merely being a functional, productive, contributing member of society does not give him an identity. It makes him "feel" like a robot.

Three, the things he says about his family pertain to manners. He means they're mentally lazy and mentally irresponsible. Likewise, his family simply throws money at him instead of spending quality time explaining why things are the way they are. His siblings are probably physically successful, but they aren't socially respectful. They take their emotional fire for granted, and disregard him because he doesn't feel the same way.

When you want to treat him as an adult, talk about rights, not responsibilities. He needs something to live for. Don't talk about mere survival. Also, don't expect him to have all the answers. He doesn't know anything.

I get the impression that his family tried to drill him with work ethic when he was growing up, but it didn't take because he's just not that type.

In turn, he got stuck in a vicious cycle of gray. Because of being drilled with work ethic, he didn't see anything to aspire for, so he didn't work. Therefore, he seemed lazy, and got drilled more, so he didn't see anything to aspire for, so he didn't work. Therefore, he seemed lazy, and got drilled more...

...you need to have a personal discussion with him. He seems very embarrassed about enjoying himself, and he's afraid of showing what he's embarrassed about because of how he was treated while growing up. Asperger's sufferers often endure anhedonia, so this isn't a surprise.

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