Out of Control

Postby Spilling » Sat Jul 16, 2016 1:19 am

The back drop:.....

I have been married 36 years. The first 25 years were charmed....Great career, great family, good marriage ....all good...

The last 11 years have been hell:

Lost business and wealth
Daughter renounced our core faith and married a middle easterner (only significant because of our faith differences)
Son develops mental illness and is in and out of psych hospitals constantly, arrested multiple times, has a child and so on..
Wife has melted down and has learned to cope through drinking....drinking a lot.

So yeah we have been through the mill and our marriage has deteriorated significantly. I try to keep everything together and rebuild a career at 58 so yes I have my hands full. Every night I come home to hear my wife tell me the exact same story of how her life sucks so bad and how no one understands how horrible her life is. Her once warm personality has vanished into a shell of constant conflict and trying to prove that the world is out to get her. Typical night.....starts out slow but then the passive aggressive comments start...yes, the exact same ones every night....then every conversation, every news story, every tv show, even comedies somehow are used to highlight her horrible life and how bad I am as a husband. Then the drinking starts about 9:00 and whatever filters were there are now gone and the war begins.

I am not seeking sympathy...I am seeking help for my anger. I am so sick of hearing the exact same stories and the exact same dialogue which begins every single time we talk. I now lose my temper every time she starts in and I honestly can't stand to be in the same room with her. I know she needs her own help but I desperately want to be able to deal with the situation without losing my cool every time. I have never touched her but my verbal assaults are frequent and severe. I might not be able to help her but I want help for myself.....

What can I do?
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#1

Postby Leo Volont » Sat Jul 16, 2016 12:18 pm

My God Man! You don’t need Anger Advice… you Need an Escape Plan!

Your Situation there is simply untenable. So Leave. Your Wife can take charge. After all, Originally Business was your Business and the Home was Her Affair… true enough, right?. How Dare she get drunk and try to put it all on you!? Well, let her sober up and get back up in the Saddle, because you going off to seek New Horizons.

No, Don’t tell anybody! You have to keep it secret so you can corner all the Money you possibly can before you split. Remember the Old Joke about the Guy who says to his Wife “Honey, I’ll be back in a minute… just going to the store for a Pack of Smokes” and leaves with three suitcases and a Steamer Trunk… Well, that will be YOU.

Where to Go? You’re American, aren’t you. Well, America has these Little Island Territories that a lot of people don’t even know about, but they get the Mail and you can still collect your Social Security. But the American 50 States Forget the Territories even Exist, and the Little Islands don’t really care about the 50 States. That Means that the Police do not Talk Each Other. So you can Virtually Disappear in one of those Territories, and no one will think to come looking for you there, and you will still have many of the Benefits of being an American Citizen. And what about your New Career? Well, the People on these Islands are Lovely and Fun, but they ARE rather Culturally Easy Going… and that means that None of them can Take Charge of Anything because way down deep none of them Care much about anything… that is the Bad Thing about being Easy Going. So Anglos are ALWAYS in Demand. The Joke is “Here on Our Own Island, why don’t we give the Jobs to Our Own People instead of those Anglos?” and the punchline is… “Because Somebody Has To Do The Work”.

I’ve done a lot of World Travelling and have been in the Territories and whenever I meet an American who is a Resident… not just a Tourist… I laugh and ask who they killed that they have to still be ‘cooling their heals’ on that island. And sometimes I see that I actually Hit the Mark, so I cut my laugh short and change the Subject.

Yes, your Sense of Moral Decency is Appalled by this Suggestion.

But there is Something about Flying Off in a Jet Airplane. When you see your Old City receding in the Distance, miles away and thousands of feet below. It makes a NEW MAN out of you. Once the Wheels of that Jet Liner jump off that Runway, You are a New Man! You can be a Happy Man.

Good luck! Oh, if you REALLY want to see your Punishment Through and stay in your Purgatory, then I will give you some Anger Advice. But, from my point of View, YOU ARE NOT AN ANGRY MAN. You are Almost an Old Man and never had trouble with Anger before. So THIS IS NOT ANGER. What This Is is TOO MUCH. What we used to Say in the Army was “Sometimes It’s Time to Just Get the Heck Out of Dodge”… a reference to Dodge City, famous from the Old Wild West… You’re a Man! You won’t be the First Man to ever pull up Roots and seek New Beginnings… and you won’t be the last.
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#2

Postby Spilling » Sat Jul 16, 2016 2:04 pm

Leo,

It's a tempting notion.......

White sand with moderate sized waves rolling in, a dark skinned, 25 year old island girl at my side, no cell phones.....no tablet.....no problems....just me. (sound of record being scratched!)

Leo, there are so many reasons why I can't do this....and it is not because I don't know about the "islands"....I have connections there already. It's not about the money.....while I have had to rebuild by career...that's going pretty well (other than the 70 hours per week) and I have just finished a book which looks like will bring value to the table.

I am sure that a worldly guy as your self tires of hearing what I am about to say.....

But my commitments I have made to my God, my wife, my family and those who look up to me as a leader and a role model far outweigh the temptations to bale....don't think I haven't labored over the notion! In terms of my past issues with anger....I have always had somewhat of a temper, but it was relatively controlled:

* In business I might have lost my temper once every couple of years
* At home I might have lost my temper 2-3 times a year
* socially - never

to describe the things that trigger me, and don't trigger me.......

* I was a victim of mugging, which turned into a 15 minute brawl (yeah the whole fist fight, rolling on the ground type of thing)....not once during that incident did I lose my temper.
* I have been publicly (and wrongfully) blamed for serious things....things that destroyed my ministry at many places....I was even accused of involvement of a securities felony and was investigated by the FBI and was forced before a Federal Grand Jury...(now there's an experience!) ....no loss of temper.
* My wife, for the 100th time mentions the incident on our honeymoon (36 years ago) where I was not as attentive as I should have been and asked her if I could have some time alone without talking. This makes me crazy and I blow...... Of course there is a reason why I needed the time alone...I was crushed the night before (wedding night) as I had remained a virgin my whole life, saving myself for the one I would someday marry. (and no, I am not a nerdy "couldn't get a girl" guy) I was very popular when young, star athlete, fancy car at 16 years old and always had money....I had access to sex but refrained so I could truly be the husband I wanted to be. So on our wedding night, my wife asked me to keep some of my clothes on and asked if we could refrain from sex for awhile because she was scared.......I was crushed and disillusioned and a million thoughts were going through my head....so I needed time to think and process while the pressure was off for her so she was having the time of her life. This is a real example where she keeps pointing to the past at an incident which hurt her but never gives me the chance to explain my hurt.....and the one time I did...her response was "Get over it"....because for her....intimacy is one of many things on a list of marital "to dos"....for me...it was my primary need.
* After working a 10 hour day, then wrangling my mentally ill, adult son for 4 hours....then listening to my wife's stresses of the day for 60-90 minutes....she then says something like "but you wouldn't get it....I'm the one with all the stresses while you get (yes "get") to go to work"......I blow
* A customer accuses me of misleading them when I know I haven't. This is very rare as I have a very good reputation in business. but when it happens....I blow
* My wife asks if we can talk about our marriage problems. I say fine as long as we reflective talk....she spends 15 minutes telling of her perspective on a problem, I listen, then I try to reflect and tell my perspective......and I can't get 5 words out without interruption and contradiction of every word.......I blow

Hopefully that provides insight...and as you (with some insolence) suggested......yes I guess I do want to see my punishment through and I want to learn to manage "my" behavior regardless of the behavior of others.

Yours from Dodge....Spilling
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#3

Postby Leo Volont » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:18 am

Dear Spilling,

Wow! What a Great Presentation. I hope my Reply to you had helped elicit such a well written and detailed Response. In that way my Reply would have been ‘good for something’.

Yes, even while Writing my ‘Escape On a Jet Plane’ Plan for you, I knew that I was simply entertaining a kind of Fantasy. But then, once the writing was over, and I had time to Ponder what I wrote… well, Too Many Holes! Too many potential setbacks and complications. I am rather surprised at myself for Tunnel Visioning through so many such Obvious Objections. But… Writing all of that had been a
Great Deal of Fun. WAS Fun! And I hope you enjoyed it a bit, as kind of a Whiff of Fragrance from some Out of Reach Piece of Forbidden Fruit. The Way you Reprised my Advice… well, you apparently understand the Appeal of what I writing about. So maybe, you had indeed enjoyed reading it.

But NOW, down to fresh Anger Management Business.

Yes, you are not a Temperamentally an Angry Man. It was impressive that you could Keep Yourself Well Under Control even when under prolonged Investigation – such things are stressful and it is difficult not cross the line of merely being Peevish about it all. But Not getting Angry during a Life or Death Fight, well, surprisingly, Nobody Does! Survival Instincts put all Energy into the Good of the Fight. In my youth I was quite a Dare Devil, and had gotten into some very serious Safety Scrapes. Afterward, I might be angry with myself for trying This or That Stupidly Dangerous Thing, but AT THE TIME where one’s Life is in the Balance, adrenaline is Finally in its Proper Niche, and it Sharpens the Focus. Surprisingly, considering one is under So Much Pressure (Life or Death), every Move One Makes is precise, well carried out, and Exactly the Correct thing to do. Or maybe I have just been Lucky… lucky… lucky…

But you Still have a bit of a Marginal Anger Problem. Yes, your Anger occurs seldom enough that the people you work with are not Afraid to be around you. That is Good. What is Bad is that several times a year, or so, you hear or experience something you don’t like (a Challenge to your Reputation’s ‘Territory’, in most cases) and you Treat Everybody to a Grand Dramatic Scene. Wouldn’t That tend to make people tense up around you. You are not Fun or Pleasant when you are Spouting Off about how Cruelly and Unjustly you’ve been Used. If would be Better if You could Meet Every Situation with a Calm and Nonchalant Voice. For instance, those Customers who accuse You of misrepresenting your Product or Service. You could hear the Accusation, and then pause and think for a moment, and then calmly say “Oh! I think I might have figured out what happened -- the Client’s Boss probably Jumped Him for Buying the Wrong Thing (or requesting the Wrong Service), and to Save his Own Skin, decided to Toss Me Under the Bus … Who KNOWS what pressures that Poor Devil was under… BUT, that Guy Definitely owes me a Big Favor.” Wow! That would be a GREAT WAY to react, rather than by Defending your Judgement, Integrity, and Competence… ALL OF WHICH you should Assume that Nobody holds in the least bit of Doubt.

Anyway, Once you become Aware of the Unpleasantness and Non-Necessity of EVER getting Angry At Work, I don’t have a concern in the World that a man of your capabilities won’t Fix that Problem (more on that below). HOWEVER, your Wife is a Very Complicated Issue…. The Primary Reason I wanted you to just Pick up and Run… and avoid the Whole Nasty Can of Worms of having to Deal with Her.

Have you ever read Jane Austin’s “Pride and Prejudice”? A Wonderful Book. But what made me Think of it in This Application was the Behavior of the ‘Girl’s’ Father towards the Mother. The Father (Mr. Bennet, I believe) was a Very Sensible Man with Impeccable Integrity. His Wife was a very Talkative Fool. It became Clear as the Story Progressed that Mr. Bennet was ignoring everything his Wife Said… wasn’t Investing in Any of That At All. Of course it was Kind of Her not to Insist on his Responding and forcing Confrontations. BUT, would your Wife Let You Get Away with “YES DEARing” everything she says. For instance, she says “You always neglect me and you have no clue about my special needs, and I should have married Ralph instead of you…” And you say “Yes Dear”. Have you Tried It? You’ve been Talking to Her and Trying to Communicate with Her for your Entire Marriage, and we can see how that has been working out for you. And, yes, of course, you are doing the Right Thing, but you need to find something that Works, and which ISN’T explicitly Evil. What Good is Good if it has no Effect. Doing Good may leave you Morally Blameless, but you are a Businessman. A New Associate may be technically Blameless, at the Moral Level, for failures of Correct Discernment, which causes him to bypass Opportunities or to invite in Attractive Disasters, BUT being Blameless is not the Only thing. One must Balance Blame with Success. After all, what good does it do to complain that Losing One’s Business was not one’s Own Fault. It’s Understood that good Business Men must See Things Coming, both Good and Bad, and then be Light Enough on their Feet to Handle It. Well, Marriage isn’t Business… or maybe we think that it shouldn’t be, but the point still holds, that one cannot simply Ignore Results.


Anyway, if you DO start effectively ignoring Her, certainly NEVER admit to it. Answer everything in the least number of words possible, and be sure to call her Dear or Darling, which she might find extremely annoying, but people would find it very odd if she should List It as one of her Complaints. Oh, when she has been Drinking, say something like “Dearest, you’ve said yourself that it does no good to talk once you’ve been drinking, so can we pick this back up tomorrow?” If she says “BUT I NEVER SAID THAT!”. Well, the answer to that is, “Well, I guess when you said it you were drinking and can’t remember”… NO! that is another one of my Amusing Tricks, BUT, you should insist on not talking when Drinking. And in other cases, where your Wife wants to continue a Conversation past your few carefully chosen words, well, something like this might work -- “Darling, I see that this is very important to you, but, I simply have so much Business to attend to. Could we Pick it back up Later”, and then excuse yourself and go to your Study.

Oh, Dear! You DO have a Private Study don’t you? Every Man should. If you don’t ‘study’ then you can call it your Workshop, Office or Studio. One of the most endearing memories of my father was when I had gotten wrestles in the house doing nothing, and I heard all kinds of power tools going in the Garage. So I went out to see if I could be of any Help. Yes, the Tools were going, but my father was sitting back reading a book! He confessed that I had ‘caught him’, that often he uses the Excuse of Working In the Garage for no other purpose then to secure some Peace and Quiet (even with a Buzz Saw roaring several inches from his elbow) . Anyway the One Big Rule about Private Studies is that NOBODY gets to walk into your Study (library, studio,office, workshop, or whatever). A Charming Observation in regards to that book I mentioned, “Pride and Prejudice” was that Mr. Bennet allowed One Exception to the inviolable Privacy of his Study, and that was in regards to his Daughter Elizabeth… the Hero of the Book… a heart-warming exception.

Well, enough Ad Hoc Advice. Time for Generically Good Advice. Go over the Reviews for the available Anger Management Books and start with a few you like. (I like “Anger Management” by Peter Favaro because it is relatively complete and very well organized, and the books by Potter-Efron, who has written quite a few on Anger and they all come across as very insightful and helpful). Basically, you NEED books that will keep feeding you Ideas on Anger Management. You are Very Intelligent. I doubt that anybody could tell you anything that you did not already know SOMETHING about, BUT you need some Regularly Scheduled Device to Keep your Attention Focused, for a dedicated Time Slot Every Day, on Contemplating the Hows and Whys of Anger Management. And Every Good and Thoughtful Author in the Anger Management Field has a few Good Ideas – a few ‘Neat Tricks’. Oh, if I were to write a Book, one piece of Advice would be Prominent, and that is that MOST Anger Explosion Episodes are propelled by Adrenaline. Adrenaline Kicks in Very Fast, but NOT instantaneously. You have a bit longer than a Single Second to Shut Down an Adrenaline Reaction. So you HAVE TO be able to Identify Your Very First Adrenaline Twitch, in order to you have the necessary time to just WILL the rest of the Adrenaline Reaction Away (which is as easy as just making a Quick Mental Veto of it). For myself, the First Sign of Adrenaline is that my Jaw Tightens… my teeth clench. I have conditioned myself to effectively Freeze whenever that happens, and it has kept me out of a lot of trouble. Also, I have 4 sometimes Very Naughty Kitty Cats, and my Device for Refraining from Anger has come to Their Aid perhaps Hundreds of times.

This Post is dragging on and on. So, let’s give it a rest, and see what you think…
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#4

Postby Spilling » Sun Jul 17, 2016 2:27 pm

Oh my gosh Leo........

I just spent an hour and a half writing a response......

it was charming, thoughtful, poignant and humorous! I spent so much time pouring out my soul.....that the site timed out and I lost the whole thing when I finally hit "Submit".....sigh.....

I can't redo it....I type way too slow....but I will pick up a couple of the books you mentioned

Regards
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#5

Postby Spilling » Sun Jul 17, 2016 2:46 pm

I will try and summarize without the anecdotes

I have tried the Bennet approach (modified).....hasn't worked.
I have tried declining talk when she is drinking....not even close to working
I have tried "The study"....she chases me around the house, around the yard, around the town....I swear she is part bloodhound...even tried locking the study door once.....so much for the door....23 holes now remain from the large shears that she used to destroy the door. (yes really) When she can't find me she blows up my phone and leaves messages (20 at a time) until my message box is full.

I still lover her and am committed to solving this.....that's what guys like me do.....
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#6

Postby Leo Volont » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:58 am

Spilling wrote:Oh my gosh Leo........

I just spent an hour and a half writing a response......

it was charming, thoughtful, poignant and humorous! I spent so much time pouring out my soul.....that the site timed out and I lost the whole thing when I finally hit "Submit".....sigh.....

I can't redo it....I type way too slow....but I will pick up a couple of the books you mentioned

Regards


Dear M. Spilling,

You might have guessed, from the length of my Posts, that I have lost a few hours myself to Time Outing Sites... SO, whenever I anticipate making any significant Reply, I put it on a Word Document, and when I am done Editting (yes, I found editing necessary although it does add a significant amount of time to the Chore), I Copy and Paste it on over to the Site.

This is Also a good habit to get into if you are Prone to making Angry Posts... the additional clerical steps involved in copying the document over might give you a moment to 'think twice' about it.

I'm sorry I missed your pages. But, when it has happened to me, I take it in the Spirit of a Massive Editing, shrug my shoulders (I NEVER think in terms of swear words... they tend to stir one up and make one Angry) and pull up a clean page for my next Attempt, and then, when I Finally Finish it, well, I always find it better somehow. But it IS Time Consuming! Thank God my blessed Mother taught me how to Touch Type.... she saw that liked to read and simply inferred from that that I would like to write. So it IS perhaps far easier for me to Just Whip These Things Out. So, yes, I will Miss what must be forever lost....
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#7

Postby Leo Volont » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:27 am

Spilling wrote:I will try and summarize without the anecdotes

I have tried the Bennet approach (modified).....hasn't worked.
I have tried declining talk when she is drinking....not even close to working
I have tried "The study"....she chases me around the house, around the yard, around the town....I swear she is part bloodhound...even tried locking the study door once.....so much for the door....23 holes now remain from the large shears that she used to destroy the door. (yes really) When she can't find me she blows up my phone and leaves messages (20 at a time) until my message box is full.

I still lover her and am committed to solving this.....that's what guys like me do.....


Dear Monsieur Spilling,

As Kipling said, You are a far far better man than I am Gunga Din.

Many of us who start Life as Starry Eyed Idealists find themselves eventually Disillusioned by Life. The Incredibly High Standards we expect of ourselves in our Youth take a Huge Beating as we go through Adulthood, and all our Best Ideals come out Tattered, Torn, Frayed, and with Sizeable Chunks Missing. But You have been able to Keep it all Together! Remarkable!

Let me tell you a short story... I hope I can keep it short... when I was still a very young man, I became fascinated with Yoga and Meditation and all of that stuff, and took it quite seriously at the time. So I worked my way around the World taking jobs Cruise ships, and by shorting the Miles and getting Some Money I finally made it to India -- the veritable Place to Go for Yoga and Meditation (and all of that stuff). I got to the place where Buddha sat under the Tree and became Enlightened and tried to Meditation there, but the Guards kicked me out... but within Half a Mile, outside the Big Sacred Fence, was Another Tree.... Close Enough! I thought (you see, my High Standards even then were finding Short Cuts). In just what wasn't more than a few hours of Meditation I had this Remarkable Vision ... I suppose I fell asleep and had a Hugely Important Dream.... sometimes Dreams can be Important... Note the Dreams of Joseph in Egypt.... Well, my vision was that I was given an Audience with the High Celestial Guru, a remarkably impressive Figure, and he told me "TO BE YOUR OWN MASTER, YOU MUST FIRST BECOME YOUR OWN SLAVE".

Wow! I THOUGHT I knew what that meant. Well, now that I have been talking to you, YES, I knew what it meant. You REALLY have been able to Become your own Master by making a Slave of yourself. I pursued that same Course for Years, for, after all, it was a Holy Vision (I still believe that). But as the years progressed I began to think that the High Celestial Guru may have in fact given me something of a two sided Riddle (the Ancient Greek Oracles were Famous for that kind of thing). I asked myself, If I AM my own Master, well, How Hard must I treat my own Slave? I began to think that Master and Slave should be Companions on the Same Journey... Yes the Spiritual Master should eventually Transcend and go beyond the Physical Embodied Slave, but while the two go Together through Life it should be with Mutual Consideration and Compassion. The Idea of a Dog and its Master kept coming back to me. And in Most of the Civilized World, Dogs are treated like Family. In Society, Nobody would confess to Beating a Dog!... it would be utterly too shocking!

So I am Stuck like a Mule between Two Piles of Hey. There is Your Astounding Adherence to the Highest Moral, Social and Ethical Standards. And Then there is the Misery you are subjecting yourself to. You appear to be your Most Severe and Demanding Judge and Master. You are veritably flogging yourself. Any ‘lesser’ man would simply take the ESCAPE CLAUSE that his Wife was flagrantly Disobedient and Undutiful. You apparently are a Religious Man, God Bless You, so it would be Perfectly Understandable if you had Set certain Religious Standards for you Wife to Live By… or else!

Oh! I remember. You Love her. I was married myself, and found my Wife completely Hateful, but it was she who finally asked for a Separation, and since I did not understand exactly what ‘Separation’ was supposed to mean, I told her surely she could think of something better than that, and so SHE filed for the divorce. … Making me the Happiest Man in the World. It reminds me of something funny I heard out in the Islands, that a Man has Two Happiest Days of His Life – the Day he Buys a Boat, and the Day he is able to Sell it. Well, I got Married to a ‘Boat’, that luckily decided to ‘Sell’ herself.

Why does your Wife stick with you?

It is a shame that Most Marriage Counselors think it somehow Unethical to recommend Divorce. I have Spoken to Psychologists about it, and it seems their general policy is to continue to Save the Marriage at all costs, come Hell or High Water, that is UNTIL one of the Mismatched Couple actually initiates the Conversation, bringing up the whole idea of Advisability of Divorce. That is what many Psychologists hope for and which many of those poor wretched Atheists (for the most part) pray for deep in their soul… to replace the useless and futile therapy with an actual Plan for making it all somehow Better.

Oh, and about Love. I honestly Love my cats, and some I love more than others. Some cats I love so much I wonder what I will do if I survive them and they die first. Well, you know what happens? The Love in your Heart finds Somewhere Else to Go. It always does. So don’t worry about Losing Love… your love is Unstoppable and will find something else, something Better, to Love.
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#8

Postby Leo Volont » Wed Jul 20, 2016 12:45 pm

.Dear Monsieur Spilling,

Please don't give up hope in my ability to generate some advice that might turn out to be Useful for you, which I understand has been in rather short supply.

Yes, in your case, Useful Advice is not exactly Low Hanging Fruit... and I actually ponder your case throughout the day... sometimes I wish I could turn off my Ever Churning Brain, but it keeps churning away.

My Ponderings eventually brought me to this One Situation that I was aware of, in which it was the Husband who was an outrageously rude, predatory and narcissistic confrontation to everything Decent and Holy. But His Wife was an absolute Angel about it. Of course I wondered how! I kept an eye on the two and soon found out the answer to that riddle -- the Wife had a Best Friend! The Center of Her Active Emotional Life was her Best Friend... NOT her Idiot of a Husband. It kind of reminded me of my Own Marriage... my wife and I had to move from location to location, and She was always a bit Difficult in any New Place until she would meet up and make a NEW BEST FRIEND. The Pressure would suddenly be Off. It supports what I have been Maintaining all along, that Men and Women are not MEANT to Live Together as COMPANIONS... that any Reasonable Household should have a HE Side and a SHE Side. Man and Wife should only have to collide once a day ... at a rather formal Evening Meal Time (I am confused by Modern English... is that called 'supper' or 'dinner'?) . And Everyone, for an hour or so, can be expected to dress up and be on their Best Behavior. As far as Marital Intimacy, well, it can be arranged the same way as Single People arrange their Intimate Encounters -- 'Dates' can be requested and planned for, and, again, it would help to support the tendency for both of the Partners to stay on their Best Behavior............ But I am getting off track, am I not?

But that brings us back to a very important question... DOES your wife have a Best Friend? Some Women hate other Women. Well, NEVER marry a woman that hates other women, for, if they hate other women, then what must they think of themselves?
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