The Bolt-hole

I tend to get Richard's earlier remark about these links. These conspiracy sites aren't very reliable. They hark back to alien abduction claims and Roswell saucers. When I challenged the posters over Israel history and used historical sources, all they could do was "moderate" my answers. Then just cover their ears, chant "no,no!" and retreat to a land of preferred reality. I honestly found those people were ignorant of history as a whole, let alone Aramaic and Hebrew, Greek texts.
I wouldn't trust all those links. Many of those people are laughing all the way to the bank. The so-called "doctors" that lead the "research" tend to have studied wacky phd subjects, far removed from academia.

I dare say the Icke site will be saying the near nuclear disaster was all "planned" by the dreaded illuminati. Funny though. Had it gone off (which it very nearly did) that would have scuttled the illuminatis original plan to poison us all in mass. Why struggle with vaccines where you can just trigger a war. Or, do the illuminati keep changing tactics. Personally, they appear to be a bunch of bungling incompetents.

davidbanner99@ wrote:Why struggle with vaccines where you can just trigger a war.

Quite. People with an ounce of logic saw through the mass jabbing campaign from the first. Unfortunately a LOT of people in this country were happy to do their bit for the caring Government.

This https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... nsultation sounds like a Good Thing but seeks to replace personal responsibility in favour of "the public interest". The proposed reforms would give Parliament power to decide when people can have human rights, and when they can't. For example:

Point 57: Potential scenarios could cover where an individual was likely to spread a particularly infectious disease with high human mortality to a significant number of others... Any assessment of whether the threat was serious and imminent would be done with regard to the advice of the CMO and emerging local or global scientific advice.

Point 58: Special restrictions and requirements may only be contained in regulations which indirectly enable their imposition...
a requirement that a person submit to medical treatment
a requirement that a person be removed to a hospital or other suitable establishment
a requirement that a person be detained in a hospital or other suitable establishment
a requirement that a person be kept in quarantine

Point 59: ... a decision to impose those requirements could only be taken in the most extreme circumstances where there was a serious and imminent threat to public health... It should be emphasised that a decision to impose such requirements would only be taken where individuals did not voluntarily accept such constraints...

The consultation closes at 11:59pm on March 8.

Theresa May seemed to nail it right. She noticed a global abandonment of democracy. That's what you see now. It started well before the vaccine crisis. So, Putin's slide from Perestroika reform to North Korean dictatorship I guess can only be challenged by real democracies. None are left.
Education and cultural decline is probably the cause. Political leaders are poorly educated thugs ruled by greed and short range thinking. That's why the economy is sinking. All this happened in the Roman Empire before it collapsed. Democracy can't be restored without a major purge of political classes and trained people put in their place. Richard Branson for example.

davidbanner99@ wrote:It started well before the vaccine crisis.

That depends on what date you give for the "vaccine crisis".
Are you aware that no one can patent anything that occurs naturally, only if they muck about with it? https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/news ... -19-origin
The "vaccine crisis" was engineered a long time ago.

Not very good "engineering" though is it? Supposing a Russia NATO war did take place? The virus hysteria would already have weakened Europe. Most troops are already scared to death they'll die of Covid. So, the "conspirators" on that basis of logic would have a hard time organising a "piss up in a brewery". Let alone a NWO.

davidbanner99@ wrote:Not very good "engineering" though is it?

Again, it depends what the intent was. If you're one of the millions who believe our governments hoped to protect everyone from a killer virus, no, it's clearly a monster fail. They've said as much themselves. If however you reach the same conclusion as many others have, including formerly respected scientists and doctors who've lost their jobs and are sneered at all over the msm, you'd see that the "vaccines" were never intended to protect, but to maim and kill. Mike Yeadon, for whom I have the highest respect, finally came out and said the perpetrators' early experiments with batches of "vaccines" of all different strengths had to have been an attempt to determine a lethal dose. It's now beyond dispute that some get deathjabs, some get saline, and some get placebos. And no, I don't know what's the difference between the latter two.

Supposing a Russia NATO war did take place? The virus hysteria would already have weakened Europe. Most troops are already scared to death they'll die of Covid.

Indeed, it's been quite the psyop. After two years of terror, there are still a LOT of people on the streets wearing NHS muzzles, even though we've been told that (for now) they're no longer compulsory. Johnson pats himself on the back for that, https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17603061/ ... d-england/. He's unrepentant, thinks he's done great things while our economy's shot to hell, millions of lives have been destroyed, and there's no question that he and his like are above the law.

What I hear is that the British Army has been weakened decade on decade. I heard this before the Russia/Ukraine posturing started, when I said we needed the army on our side. I think the word is namby-pambying. Examples given were that their diet isn't good and that they don't march if it looks like rain.

Do you think the (temporary) lifting of covid restrictions and the simultaneous declaration that WW3 is imminent is a coincidence? I don't speak for others, only for myself, when I say it's all part of the same thing and that WW3 started years ago: set the people against each other, because divided we'll surely fall.

So, the "conspirators" on that basis of logic would have a hard time organising a "piss up in a brewery". Let alone a NWO.

They're amending laws and what were once our legal rights as fast as they're able. The rewritten Human Rights Act of 1998 will slip through at midnight on Tuesday, and there's damn-all any of the people can do about it. It replaces personal agency with what's euphemistically called "the common good", enabling forced "medical" treatment and indefinite detention "in a hospital or other suitable facility" if you're considered a threat to others, by which they mean you somehow managed to avoid the said treatment until the time someone pointed a finger at you and said they heard you sneeze.

You may insult me by linking me to "conspiracy sites", David Icke/the Illuminati and extra-terrestrials all you like. The beginnings of NWO are already here, and had governments not conspired long before 2020 they could never have sprung it on the whole world at once the way they did.

Once again I stress that I've been learning as I go, and that if I knew what was going on and what exactly lay ahead I'd have to be one of Them. Most people's lives have been to put it mildly difficult for two years now, in many cases much worse than we have it in the UK. Yet.

I have great respect for your posts here but you get distracted by irrelevance and seem somewhat cut off, rejecting a lot of material because it isn't in a book, hasn't been peer-reviewed, or has been discredited by "scientists" and "experts" on government payrolls. That may well mean you'll be caught completely off-guard when it's far too late to take action.

But who's to say which of us is better off? I've spent about 18 months talking to people, reading, and investigating for myself, while watching "conspiracy" predictions come true one after the other. My hopes have been raised and dashed time and time again, and that takes its toll. But as the saying goes, once your eyes have been opened you can't close them again. You can only look away, which I mean to do in the bolt-hole, until the world hits me between the eyes.

I've never liked TV or radio, got my you-know-what kicked as a newspaper editor when I made Chernobyl the lead story on the World News page instead of on page one where everyone else had it. In my other-worldliness lies my salvation, or at least my peace of mind.

Conspiracy theory tends to be based on negativity. Most of them find a negative anchor and then feed on it. Such as the Apollo mission.was faked - because the alternative to "fake" is real success or discovery. Also the conspiracy posters program defeatism.
Given civilization lapses and rises over millenia, what we now see is a downward spiral and no amount of NWO.conspiracies can change that. What can change it is political innovation but that may now only come from.China. Europe is declining to the level of South American dictatorship. Funnily enough what shook Putin up was the destruction of France via mass immigration to the point France lost its identity. Putin is ultra nationalist and somehow strives to save Ukraine from a similar fate. Putin takes a similar course to Hitler to try and somehow force his vision.
In short the current mess is caused by unaccountable politicians and not secret societies. It's decline.and it may last centuries. The main hope is China where education continues to rise and society gradually liberalises.

davidbanner99@ wrote:Such as the Apollo mission.was faked - because the alternative to "fake" is real success or discovery.

That's not what we're discussing. Or at least, I'm not.

Also the conspiracy posters program defeatism.

I'm not interested in defeatism, nor is anyone else I talk to. We continue to meet, learn, support each other, and encourage others to question the misbehaviours that became overt early in 2020. The one thing I've given up at this stage is getting into f2f dialogue with people who've had the "vaccines" and continue to believe they're actually vaccines. Within seconds you're going to get "if I hadn't had the jab it would have been worse"; it's in the official handbook.

In short the current mess is caused by unaccountable politicians and not secret societies.

I agree. There was never any reason for them to tell us what they all agreed to do, step by step, several years ago. And at midnight tomorrow, with no public consultation, the UK Government awards itself total power over all of us. Goodbye personal responsibility, hello "the common good" as defined by the Government that brought you lockdowns, business closures, masking, social distancing, job losses, made-up case numbers, millions of deaths wrongly ascribed, track and trace, increased poverty and suicides.

The main hope is China where education continues to rise and society gradually liberalises.

I'm certainly NOT pinning my hope on China, where flu was weaponised, and whence came the "vaccine" to prevent it!

China is getting richer and therefore investing in education. China is the only country to have "diplomatically" addressed the Ukraine war without taking sides. China has managed to broadly reform all society and industry so civil rights should gradually follow. Putin failed to do the same. He is little different to Augusto Pinochet. The EU simply slides ever more backward and has a history of failed democracy. Western civilization has fallen. Causes?.Political inadequacy, immigration, lagging science and education. It's almost a peasant society of workers.

Usa seems still dynamic and has a well economy. Do you seperate usa from western civilisation or are they doomed too?

desperate788 wrote:Do you seperate usa from western civilisation or are they doomed too?

It seems to depend on which state you're in. America's a big place.

I think states in usa not so important individually. They dont have an army they use the same currency and ultimately governed from capitol city, Washington.

desperate788 wrote:Usa seems still dynamic and has a well economy. Do you seperate usa from western civilisation or are they doomed too?

To me, they always seemed plastic and false. America is dominated by profit and material gain at all levels. The driving force of society is to accumulate money but that leads to very shallow values. Just taking the example of Bill Clinton who seriously claimed he took a joint but didn't inhale. From the fake pastors to conspiracy leaders so much deceit is inspired by profit. Ancient societies tended to stress many virtues such as courage and knowedge but America's weak spot is those values are seldom taught. And that's why America always had so much crime. People were raised to value the dollar above all other virtues. At one time, the education system put a check on how far that went, but over the last decades fraud and hypocrisy started to run rampant.

I think Amerika goes well in the capitalism direction they chose whether capitalism will prevail is an other matter. The problem of Amerika is unqualified presidents like Junior bush, Trump or biden. They must solve that problem.