How can we handle these conflicts better?

Livetowin wrote:Ascendant78 its understandable to be reflective when you're so fresh from the break. But I agree with Tokeless, that you would be well served to let go of sorting through her garbage and focus on your own back yard here. What got you in trouble was only seeing her side of things instead of just seeing things as they ARE.

Anyone who has to explain themselves (or their behavior) is selling a narrative for you to follow, which is a form of control. If you see someone kicking a cat, and they tell you its okay because they were scratched by one as a child, that does not change the fact they're still hurting an animal. It's no less obvious if they turn and start kicking you for some other removed reason. Let behavior speak for itself.

And I wouldn't get hung up on what you had in common either. That mythical check list should be retitled the "First List to Disarm our Common Sense". I say that because there's no standard to meet outside of a verbal affirmation which every car salesman uses to win your influence. The number one thing you should have in common with another person is RESPECT for who they are.

You don't have to agree with everything they like or even their politics. But there should be a common ground of respect for the space you reside in, just as you would give to them. If you can't first recognize each other as human beings, you have nothing to build upon no matter the intent. If you can master that perspective, your quality of life will be so much better because you can see people for who they are, rather than asking them what they want you to see. Use (and trust) your own eyes.

Thanks for the feedback. I was sort of seeing both sides, her side of things and the reality of it, which is why it wasn't acceptable to me. I kept giving her the benefit of the doubt, but I should've stopped doing so months ago. 11mos and still the same anger issues? No, not changing.

I know in hindsight, I should've drawn the line much sooner. I just kept hanging onto her reassurance that she would work on it. But, she can't control it, and as I already said, I don't think any amount of counseling will get her there either. No matter how much we read on relationship psychology, as soon as she went into her rage, all rational thought went right out the window.

And while I didn't read it before my last reply, I did address your cat kicking analogy in my last post. You're absolutely right - no matter what she's been through in the past, she is the one making the choice now to treat me the way she is. There's no excuse for it.

As far as similarities (or for me, my list of needs, wants, and bonuses), there are some things that I do absolutely need, and it narrows down my choices in people A LOT. It sucks, but I am VERY picky.

Just to give you an idea of what I need:
1) High intelligence (I've broken up with a good amount of women in the past because they couldn't keep up, then I get bored. This cuts out at least 80% of the population in and of itself).
2) One of their top love languages has to be touch, along with quality time. (I'm VERY affectionate/cuddly and need that in a partner)
3) Family must be important to them, as I have 3 kids
4) Can't be religous, but can't be too spiritual (I like open-minded people, and religious people tend to be too credulous for me, and ones that are way over the top spiritual are too much for me too. Basically, spiritual but reasonably skeptic. This again cuts most the population off my list)
5) MUST be honest. I break up in a heartbeat if someone lies about something big.
6) Has to have a similar attraction type like me (I become more attracted to the person I'm with as the relationship builds; I lose my sexual attraction to all other women, so loyalty with me could never be an issue)
7) Sex has to have serious meaning to them. If they've had multiple FWBs in the past and are fine with that type of thing, I can't do it.
MUST appreciate me and the relationship (what I offer).
9) MUST have respect and consideration for me (can't deal with someone who is really self-centered).

Those are just the needs I can think of off the top of my head. Then, there are wants, and things that are a plus. My list is HUGE, and she met almost every single thing on there. I even added some things because of her. So yes, respect like you said is a big one, but I need far more than that.

But, two BIG ones she no longer meets is respect and consideration for me, along with appreciating me.

I have a bad habit of giving people too much of the benefit of the doubt, along with trying to see the best in them. When they wrong me, I will sometimes make up excuses for them in my head. I know I need to stop doing that. Any man in their right mind would have left the first time she lashed out for no good reason.

Maybe one day, she'll fix it. But with how she feels it's my fault and a personality clash, I feel like she is a LONG ways from that. I'm just moving on. I don't think she'd ever have fully appreciated me. She just doesn't value a relationship like I do.

gregor7782 wrote:“She” may feel differently about how you see her behavior and what she chooses to or not to do. My point, it’s easy to identify the liabilities in others or in causes and conditions. The bottom line is: what will you do about your own conduct and decisions therein? You get to decide what is acceptable. You get to decide what standards you will or won’t uphold and those decisions have nothing to do with anyone but you. Respectfully. That isn’t to say you don’t consider how others may feel, but taking care of you is not negotiable. You’ll do it, one way or the other. Unreasonable people don’t know they’re unreasonable. Be kind, necessary and true.

I think I covered most of what you wrote here in my last message. I have not let a woman overstep my boundaries in years. I made an exception with her, just because of how good the good times were.

At the absolute bare minimum though, as soon as she lashed out that first time, I should've taken a HUGE step back from the relationship until I saw her making an active effort (counseling).

She finally did that recently, but it's too late now. And it could take months for her counselor to make her aware of the things she needs to work on, if ever. If her counselor isn't direct enough, or if she tells things too one-sided, then she might never get the help she needs. I mean again, she's 42, and she hasn't gotten help up to this age. And even though she started counseling, her primary focus with it was to battle her severe depression. It wasn't even for the relationship problems. So, she might never face them. Could just go from man to man, always blaming the other person. Or, maybe finding someone passive enough to be controlled by her abuse. That's not me.

Maybe months or years down the road, her and I will meet again under better circumstances. But, I'm not counting on that.

The thing that upsets me most about this is it has caused me an existential crisis. I mean I really thought she was "the one." With how it started like a dream come true, and eventually became a living nightmare, I feel like if there is a "god" or some sort of spiritual existence, that this was a really sick and twisted joke. I thought the universe finally granted me my biggest wish and aspiration in life (finding my "twin flame"), and it was just a huge prank. So now, it's hard for me to believe in anything. No benevolent god would have let this happen. I don't believe in anythinng anymore.

Why do you insist on this girl so much she is an ordinary woman, not a beauty Queen or something like that. Your insist a bit suspicious for me if you want my True opinion.

desperate788 wrote:Why do you insist on this girl so much she is an ordinary woman, not a beauty Queen or something like that. Your insist a bit suspicious for me if you want my True opinion.

Whatever..you wouldnt tell me the truth

desperate788 wrote:Why do you insist on this girl so much she is an ordinary woman, not a beauty Queen or something like that. Your insist a bit suspicious for me if you want my True opinion.

Lol, nah I'd have no reason at all to lie. Not like I have anything to lose at this point anyway.

To start, she was VERY attractive. The sex blew anything else I had out the water (supposedly did on her end too, but now, I doubt everything she said to me). She was better with my children than anyone else they ever met, including other family, friends, etc. She was amazing with them, and that was a part of this too - she built a strong relationship with them, especially my sons. Likewise, I built a solid bond with her son, and loved her kids like I do my own. That makes it harder to walk away too.

I explained a lot of it in previous posts. It was just so much of the criteria I look for that she had. I never had any girlfriend that met that much of my list.

And the love I felt with her was new to me as well. I can't explain why. Our chemistry was just amazing.

It's like this... say all your life, you were used to bread and water (prior relationships). Then, suddenly someone puts some lobster, filet mignon, and your favorite drink in front of you (her). You suddenly have a whole new perspective on food (love).

I know it may sound stupid with our issues, but when she made me feel loved, she made me feel loved like no one ever had before. She was so sweet in the beginning. I just kept hoping to get back to that, but as time went on, it just got further and further away from it.

But anyway, that's why I thought she was "the one." I never felt a love, a chemistry, passion, etc. like that with anyone else in my past. Yes, I had decent loves and decent relationships. But, nothing like I had with her.

Now, I just need to find someone with all her good traits, but without the abusive behaviors and anger issues. Took me 44yrs to find her though, so I'm not very hopeful in finding that. Depressing. That's why I wanted so bad to save us. I figured since couple's counseling has about a 80-90% success rate, and both of us have a solid head on our shoulders, that we could fix it. But, she always had an excuse to not do couple's counseling. And as I stated previously, she didn't even get a counselor for the relationship. She got it for her depression. Maybe she is well aware she can't change her anger issues, or maybe she doesn't want to. Maybe she is fine with herself how she is, fine with treating her significant other like that. I could never accept that.

İt seems you loved her so much but everybody knows love doesnt last forever probably in every case. Its said to be 3 years at most. When people live under same roof its not possible to love eachother.

Living in the same house sex will be just easing tension no romance etc

desperate788 wrote:İt seems you loved her so much but everybody knows love doesnt last forever probably in every case. Its said to be 3 years at most. When people live under same roof its not possible to love eachother.

I'd have to ask then... how do you have these old couples that have been together for decades, still professing their love to one another?

And my mother remarried. Been with him for going on 5yrs now. Still to this day, rants all the time how she never knew she could be this happy.

Sorry, but I have to respectfully disagree on that one. I don't let love die, not as long as I believe in that person and we don't grow apart. I mean yes, people can grow apart, but if you have a truly strong bond, you're TRULY a family, you grow together, you make it work. Just like you don't just toss one of your kids out because they're being unruly (at least not in most cases), I feel people should have the same level of dedication to a relationship.

No relationship will be smooth sailing, but hell, if you stick with the same person through the years, the two of you can look back and say "we went through all that BS together." I want that. I've always wanted that. I'm just a very tough match.

I sometimes think my ex who married an other man. Now i think that i havent really loved her anytime. I was just very sick and it was a silhoutte passing by. I was thrown anywhere my limited understanding of the board sent me Now its 7 years i havent seen her and i dont care. Anyway is it possible to love someone for such a long time?

I dont know i think those old couples dont love eachother they are just used to, no alternatives, financial reasons etc

desperate788 wrote:I sometimes think my ex who married an other man. Now i think that i havent really loved her anytime. I was just very sick and it was a silhoutte passing by. I was thrown anywhere my limited understanding of the board sent me Now its 7 years i havent seen her and i dont care. Anyway is it possible to love someone for such a long time?

This post of me seemed very suspicious to me. Sorrt i have some mental illnesses.

desperate788 wrote:I sometimes think my ex who married an other man. Now i think that i havent really loved her anytime. I was just very sick and it was a silhoutte passing by. I was thrown anywhere my limited understanding of the board sent me Now its 7 years i havent seen her and i dont care. Anyway is it possible to love someone for such a long time?

I believe it is, yes. IF the connection is strong enough, IF the people are dedicated enough, and IF they continue to appreciate what the other offers.

I feel a lot of times, as time goes by with someone, they can begin to take it for granted. Like with my ex I talked about on here for example. In the beginning, she would go out of her way to make time for me. In the end, she would put anything and everything else she could ahead of me... even to the extent of waiting me wait 4.5hrs after driving in 1.5hrs of horrible traffic to get there. And 45mins of that was to go pick up one of her kids tea. Yes, a 45 min drive for TEA, and even THAT was put ahead of time with me. She had virtually no appreciation of what she had with me.

As time goes on, she'll get lonely. She will have a lot of empty time that she used to have with me. She'll feel the emptiness. She'll miss everything I used to do for her. She'll miss someone loving her so much, being so dedicated to her, etc. But, I won't be there.

Right now, she doesn't care, because she most likely thinks that at any point, she can reach out for a friendship here and keep me on the lifeline just in case for later. She is still taking me for granted, feeling she can get me back at any point.

But, she isn't going to be hearing from me at all. Last time, it took her 3 weeks to reach out. Maybe she'll never reach out again. Maybe she will in a week. Maybe her counselor will give her the wake up call she needs, and she'll realize what she gave up here. Maybe she'll finally realize it wasn't me, it wasn't us, but that it was her unresolved wounds from her past. She had someone willing to take the brunt of that damage with her, but I could only deal with so much. I didn't deserve it. All I ever tried to do was make her happy. I NEVER intentionally hurt her. She intentionally hurt me more times than I can count.

But anyway, as weeks or months go on, that emptiness will get more prominent. I know right now, she is still furious with me for something that happened right after the breakup (something I felt needed to be done), and still believing it was me/us. In time, and with the help of her counselor, she might eventually realize it wasn't. And looking back, maybe one day, she'll realize what she took for granted here. Might take dating others and not having even a fraction of what we had. Might take months of being alone. Who knows with her. She could hop on Tinder again tonight, she might not date for another couple years again. Never know with her, she is extremely unpredictable and flip-flops at the drop of a hat.

I know I'm overthinking all this. I can't help it at this point. I try to keep my mind off her, but it's just hard with how much I put into the relationship. With how much I lost. Not just her, but her family. And my kids lost her as well.

So much I wished could've been different here. But, I doubt she'd ever want to even talk to me again with how things ended this time, much less ever get back together. So, I'm doing my best to move on.

I had the some illusion i think my girlfriends cant do without me and come back crying..im wrong every time

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desperate788 wrote:I had the some illusion i think my girlfriends cant do without me and come back crying..im wrong every time

The question I would be asking myself at that point would be why are they leaving in the first place and what am I lacking that makes them leave without ever even looking back?

I am a giver in relationships. I basically spoil the person I'm with. I seriously love doing things for the people I care about. So, I'll give the person massages regularly, cuddle them, very affectionate, very attentative, all about doing the things they want to make them happy, surprise love notes snuck into their purse, random gifts of flowers just to show I care, elaborate decorative setups for holidays (like I used Xmas lights, beads, fake flowers, etc. on Xmas to make a really sweet setup around her presents), and much more. With that said, I've had at least half of my exes that broke up with me do so.

Like I said, last time we had a serious break up, she took 3 weeks to reach out to me. She used the excuse that she had stuff of mine, but she kept the message very vague, seemingly to get a response:

"I have some of your stuff here. Let me know if you want me to pack it up for you. If I don't hear from you, I'll assume you don't want it and throw it all away."

It was something along those lines. Kept what she had of mine vague, and the consequence of throwing it out if I didn't reply to her. Meanwhile, all she had was flip flops she knew came from the Dollar Tree, a pair of my shorts, and one other trivial thing I can't remember. She swore time and time again she didn't reach out with the intent to talk to me, but regardless, we got to talking about what went wrong, she finally admitted her part in things falling apart, and we tried to reconcile.

Problem was, she didn't follow through on anything she said she'd do. No individual counseling, no couple's counseling, etc. Everything I asked for she said she'd do, but then over the next few weeks, stopped making an effort and just had one excuse after another.

I miss her. I wish we could've remained friends. I wish I could've seen what counseling does for her (if anything).

I tell my counselor EVERYTHING, and I try to be as objective as possible so I can get honest feedback from her. She made it quite clear months back that at least 98% of the problem is her, and that it is from trauma from her past, trust issues, possible borderline personality disorder (or at least bi-polar disorder), and that until she realizes and acknowledges that, it will remain a problem.

IF she is honest with her counselor, if she tells her the WHOLE truth, she will tell her the same things mine did. She denied all of it and completely discredited my psychologist (who's 25+yrs in and amazing reviews). I do hope she's honest with hers, so she can tell her where the REAL problems were, what she needs to fix, etc.

I KNOW if she is honest with her and her counselor is honest back about constructive criticism, she's eventually going to realize I was right, it wasn't an issue with us, and she will almost definitely reach back out. She just doesn't believe that yet. She believes I'm doing wrong, that I'm picking fights by words I say, and that it's a personality conflict. None of that is right. The proof is weeks and weeks on end at a time with not a single fight. Everything a dream come true. Then, her mood changes, or her period comes, and arguing, fighting, etc. All it takes is me saying something she can take the wrong way, and it snowballs into a relationship-ending event.

Who knows. I might hear from her next week if she hears certain things from her counselor. Or, maybe she will twist things to her counselor as well, and she will never hear it from her. In that case, it will take her dating other men to realize it (at which there would be no chance in hell I would EVER think about things with her, under no circumstances). And who knows how many people she'll have to date and run into the same issues with before she stops blaming the men.

The thing is, if she loved me as much as she said she does, if she feels the way I feel, she won't give up, not once she realizes what she needs to realize (it's not "us" it's "her"). But, I would not be more than friends with her until she realizes and acknowledges a LOT of things, I see her working on them, and that I was confident she will fix things. Even then, I wouldn't even think about meeting with her until she set up couple's counseling. I'd need weeks of that before I would even think about anything beyond friendship.

I know it sounds crazy, it does to me too. I'd NEVER have dealt with this before. There's just something about her. About us. I've never experienced a good THAT good before. But, it could be gone forever, and I know I need to live my life like that's the case